This week in Bitcoin- 8-28-2020- Fed inflation policy, DCG BTC mining, INX noise, Winklevoss gold

Hello everyone this is adam meister the bitcoinmeister
the disrupt meister welcome to this week
in bitcoin today is august the 28th 2020
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here hello my elite friends welcome on this beautiful friday
afternoon to this weekend big points show
uh the great juan galt and btc sessions benny have returned
and andy edstrom makes his freaking debut on the show at long last
he is here oh yeah and so we're going to start off the show
with a question for him and there was i warned everyone this week that the fed
was going to make an announcement about a new inflation
target and oh we had to worship the chairman
and oh we should be scared and bitcoin didn't seem to care very
much but it does have some long-term implications on the economy and uh
why people even buy bitcoin if the if the government is straight up and uh
saying they don't have to worry about two percent inflation anymore so
uh ed what's your take on this explain uh what jerome powell did
and what what it means yeah so i think first of all yes i call you i called you
what i'm saying that's true that's right it's ed's strong but it's
amazing there's any doubt you can just read uh
read the name down here so yeah so the fed um here's my thoughts
on the fed the first was the market so the fed
delivered or announced something a little different than what
some were expecting some people were expecting
a more aggressive policy announcement some people were expecting what they
call yield curve control this has been going on in japan for
years now and the idea is oh the fed or the
central bank of whatever country you're talking about
says hey we're gonna not let yields rise above
any particular level along the whole yield curve whether it's you know one
year three year five year tenure in japan what they've done is they
pinned the 10-year yield the 10-year government bond
basically to zero now that did not happen what happened
instead was an announcement about symmetry
in the inflation target now if you'll humor me i want to read
just something short it's only about five sentences okay
the federal reserve is already laying the groundwork for lower interest rates
today on may 1st 2019 the federal open market
committee the fomc issued its periodic statement
more prominent than usual was its use of the word symmetric
with respect to its two percent annual inflation goal
this highlights the fact that the fed's mandate is to hit two percent
inflation on average which means that for every year it falls
short of two percent it should overshoot in another year to make up the
difference so basically given that the fed has
undershot its two percent target for years now it's highlighting the idea
that it could reasonably seek to overshoot the two percent target
so what am i reading well i'm sorry guys but i couldn't help myself
i'm reading from page 59 of this which is my book that i published a year
ago and the point is the fed just quote unquote announced
what they'd already basically been shooting at for years now
they've been talking about hey our inflation target is symmetric
which means if we've undershot it then we should overshoot for a while
and you know the the market i guess was sort of surprised by this
but they've been signaling this this announcement or this policy let's say
for at least a year now and probably longer and by the way they've they
failed to hit 2 inflation by their stated target but i
would say that the announcement sort of underscores or augments this
idea that hey if we've undershot for years now
we're going to overshoot so that's my take well i gotta say one
thing here they they say they've undershot for
years but come on now that we've really had i mean but the way they
define it they have i mean you can twist the numbers any way
you want to uh they they they're now they're saying
yeah okay we we under shot now we're straight up
we're going to make up the difference but there's been real inflation all
along i mean there's been real inflation i mean this is
it's nonsense this is this is all numbers games and
i mean my my big take take away from the whole thing is that
it's a bunch of mumbo jumbo and the simplify it
we haven't we've had inflation we're going to continue to have inflation the
money printer is going to keep on going burr
uh so and he says this so everybody stays confident in the economy and keeps
on buying into this if you're smart you should know if you
don't want to play this game opt out in the bitcoin
that's my big take on it so uh but and bitcoin didn't crash and bitcoin i mean
nothing to nothing really bad happened after the event i thought there might i
mean i think it pumped for a little bit but whatever
we'll see uh i don't i don't worry about jerome panel because i
i mean i'm in bitcoin so let's see if the canadian here uh
well we've got two canadians actually uh btc sessions what was your take on it
uh i mean again the way that they measure inflation is
questionable in the first place right like that
they're they're looking at the what the cpi right
is that is that what they're they're looking at and so um
if you're if you're looking at what people actually spend their money on
um i think it was guy swann that put me onto this website but the chapwood it has city by city because expenses can
vary depending on where you live but it shows like the top 500
expenditures of the average american in each city
and the inflation rate of those actual items and and when you look at
the year to your inflation with the with the top 500 things that people spend
their money on it is staggering it's double digits
every year like new york back to 2016 i'm looking at it
right now 10.8 percent 2017 was 11.2 then 12.6 then 12.1
the first half of 2020 12.7 and and that's what people spend their
money on their most common expenditures so
when they say that they've been missing their target of two percent
it's just kind of like it's bull it's not it's
it's not what the average person spending their money and trying to
scrape by is actually seeing there's there's so little that they
account for there um so yeah like i to me
his when it comes to regular americans this speech was rather
inconsequential in the fact that you're already experiencing way more than their
targeted inflation if anything it's worse uh
it's going to be worse for people everywhere because they're really just
we're we're not going to care about it anymore so um
the only people it doesn't really matter to are i guess
people like us that have opted out um and so that's that's i've really been
opting out a lot lately if you know what i mean so
yeah whatever all right juan golf did you do
you have any thoughts after everything that's been
said here yeah for sure i mean it's it really shows how disconnected
these academics are from from you know the actual normal
life of people like real estate prices have been just
straight up rising and that's not because the real estate is amazing or
the infrastructure is just booming or everything is glowing it's
because people don't have anywhere to park their money
um rent is rising everything is getting more expensive like i'm not
you know i travel to united states here once in a while and it's it's
really expensive compared to pretty much anywhere else in the world
and you think it would be cheaper given that it's the
center of capitalism worldwide the beacon of capitalism but everything's
way more expensive right and yeah so i mean i think i think
we're gonna see we're gonna see sort of real like like
further loss of purchasing power in the market
and i i just find it really interesting that right as this is happening there's
been three announcements by you know significantly sized private
businesses that are saying that they're gonna
they're gonna start holding your wealth in bitcoin because
they're basically just losing money holding it in dollars
um i think that's really exciting i think that is that might be the
beginning of a trend and this is exactly what we would expect
and want to see in bitcoin and uh hopefully there'll be a lot more
of it because yeah they're right like they
you know the dollar is in decline and and you know
i mean i could honestly see it see everything that we see in the in the
stock market and dollar continue for the next four years if
if if there's a re-election and there's not a civil war
but that's probably as far as it can go you know so
um anyway just hold on oh now pound that like button because juan
galt read my mind he brought up a subject
matter that we were going to talk about later
so in in one part of the world everyone's worried about what the fed
dude says and they try to uh make it make
their uh arrangements around what he says all right
in the real world and say that's the big story of the day the fed has spoken
to me the big story of the day is what juan just mentioned
it's the big story of the year how microstrategy balt
uses bitcoin as this reserve asset right now and what ron
juan referred to is there are some canadian companies smaller ones at that
that are also using uh the the uh bitcoin as its
reserve asset okay uh now i i love that this is going on i thought the micro
strategy announcement again was the biggest news of the year
it was from two weeks ago now but the uh one of those canadian companies made
that their announcement this week so we'll go
to another canadian here uh btc benny uh you know about these other companies
small canadian companies i think uh part of the reason that you
know and i don't blame them you know to put it out there on social medias
it's gonna it's gonna help their brand a lot i mean they saw that how popular the
microstrategy uh tweet got so why not say say so i really
hope they did it um but do you see this as a trend uh
btc benny and do you have any uh a canadian take on it since
those two companies were canadian after a microstrategy that made their
announcement yeah i mean i think
i think outside of the u.s it might be even looked at as more attractive to be
taking these types of moves if if i'm again and i'm kind of guessing
here but i would say that the last domino to fall
would be the world reserve currency if we were moving towards something
different right if we're moving towards a bitcoin standard
the last domino to fall would be the the uh the currency that everybody kind of
needs to use um but when you're dealing with other
currencies smaller currencies that don't have as much demand
um they're likely going to inflate quicker than than the us dollar
over time um and so i think
i mean again like i i i see how much the value of the canadian dollar can
fluctuate versus the us dollar at one point we're at parity um and
that's definitely not the case now um and so yeah like the
one was uh the company was tahini's i believe and they've got a reference
chain the other one was snappa by the way the
post by snappa the actual blog post that they put up
man that was a killer post because they went
deep into detail they went into the history of money
they started talking about rye stones and angry beads and
and how what was thought to be a sound money was displaced by people coming in
that could duplicate the money and dilute it very easily
um and then they went into like the the how bitcoin is built and how it
guarantees scarcity like they knew their stuff they did their research
as i'm sure microstrategy and tahini's even did
um but it just kind of shows like they they're hardcore about it they
understand what they're getting into um and i definitely think this is a trend
to to kind of tag on to this uh there was
an interview with plan b and i i can't remember what podcast it
was on but he was talking about um his stock to flow model based
on uh phase transitions where he's talking about
moving from different narratives and and use cases
and um a lot of people make the jump from individuals using bitcoin to nation
states using bitcoin but there's this interim where he said
it's more likely that you're gonna get uh
companies and institutions using this as a reserve asset
first and that could potentially be this next
kind of cycle which coincides with the having actually
quite beautifully starting to see this and maybe the next time
around is where we start to see nation states
jump on board so i would not be surprised to see this kind of
bitcoin epoch to be the epoch of of institutions moving to this as at least
a portion of their their reserves and then the
next epoch we start to see nation states jump on board because they realize that
companies have done so well from it so uh yeah it's exciting to see i 100 agree
this microstrategy thing was massive and also because it wasn't a
small allocation they took i think it was 250 million of their 500
million dollars of liquid cash and just dumped it into bitcoin
uh and that that takes uh that the person is is
well endowed in the nether regions we'll say for having done that pound
that like button for phrasing it that way because it's a
family channel all right hey and i want to say you you pointed
out that that dude from canada had a really great post explaining
why they jumped into it well it wasn't a jump it was very well thought out
it is linked to below actually his tweet is you can click on the suite
all three of these dudes that are on the show their twit
twitter twitters are linked to below also so follow all of them
andy uh your take on what we've been talking about here uh these these
companies and getting into bitcoin and uh is and
but and i want to point out btc better before i leave your canadian
topic i don't know how anybody you know canadians it's it's a great country
strong country but uh they gotta see that that this uh
what's going on now the the canadian dollar has fallen uh faster
than the united states why value your wealth in loonies or whatever
they call canadian dollars now is beyond me and all canadians can get
they can get into the us dollar if they want to but they all can get into
bitcoin too so there's there's no excuse um i mean it's not
it's not like hyperinflation is on the way to canada or anything but it's a
worse way of life and i just don't i i think too many people are stuck in
the paradigm there i'm keeping my money in the canadian bank hahaha
dude i mean this is this is not the time to do that at all
and i i'm glad and i think there is something to be said
that some of these these are canadian companies that are
doing this yeah don't be alone get out of the loony
i think it is better for i think it's better for companies
individuals outside the united states to do this to to make bitcoin their reserve
currency their reserve asset uh because you're in and if i mean maybe
maybe if you're in the yen or the euro it's a little different but these second
tier these second-tier currencies they seem
great until they're not great so all right sorry about that little but i
did want to point that out andy you can you can
take it away now yeah yeah no i agree with all that i agree with
btc sessions you know even though this is you know this news is
as you say a couple weeks old it all bears repeating right this is huge
um i pardoned the shill but uh i squared off with preston pish and we talked
about this uh just a couple nights ago on the swan
signal podcast which uh i encourage people to check out
and yeah it's it's huge it's right that you
know it's it's interesting that it's an
american company that that came in in size
i love the quantity right because you pointed out is 200
approximately 250 million my favorite thing about it though is is that it's
21 000 roughly bitcoins right very convenient number it's almost
exactly 0.1 percent of the entire supply so 0.1 of bitcoin those are off those
are off the market at least probably for this cycle and it
doesn't take too many 0.1 you know buys
for uh because we know the that the hodlers like you and me and a
lot of people listening on this call you know we ain't
selling my bitcoin ain't for sale um certainly not at it at
any price you know within an order of magnitude or
two of where we are right now so it's huge
news the other thing and i'm sorry to repeat what i said on
this other pod was it's one thing for companies that uh
that basically go public you know they put a third of
their treasury in i mean that's huge that's material
that's board level uh you know decision probably that had
to go into that what's interesting to think about too
though is how many cfos and treasurers are saying uh how about two percent
right and that's that doesn't really rise to
the level of materiality right we have this concept
in in uh in finance which is you know enough to
matter basically for the shareholders of the
company well if it's not material they can do it without announcing it so
i think you know for every uh microstrategy
right for every michael sailor who's like
i'm all in there's how many um who are sort of quietly
gonna accumulate put one to two percent of their treasury in
you know the cfos you know the cfo talks to the treasurer the treasurer is like
you know i'd like to put one to two points of our
treasury into into bitcoin and the cfo's like yeah sure you know
maybe we're an international company obviously we have
we hold a lot of dollars but maybe we hold some euros maybe we hold some yen
um one to two percent bitcoin sure what the hell yeah i i think
it's great that com that certain companies are structured in that way
where they don't i didn't that's a really good point i
thought you always need the board's approval or something like that to make
such yeah not if it doesn't you know if it's
small enough size um you know it's it's considered sort of
normal course in in in business now i think you're right
that it may depend on you know the case or
the situation some boards may keep sort of a tighter
leash right on their management team others are happier to delegate authority
um you know with private companies private
companies can run themselves you know as they see fit you know within
the confines of the law basically and so yeah it doesn't surprise me at
all that it's uh smart canadians that uh figured out that this is all you
know also that this is a good idea and for every one of them that's
announced it publicly you know there may be 10
that are that are just you know nibbling a little bit
yeah all right i i i again i thought it was it's
such a huge finally you get that confirmation that
a a very large company bought point one percent of all the bitcoin out there and
then if a hundred companies do that it's
unbelievable the difference that it makes so
may that happen soon and all of you individuals out there you better think
of it that way because you probably can't buy point one
percent of all the bitcoin out there but there are plenty of companies that do
and you want to do it you want to get your piece of the pie uh
you want to get out of no coiner land before they get into uh elite status
land all right dudes a reminder yesterday's
show was uh we had a guest on from venezuela the great gabriel made his
return check it out dudes it is uh linked to
below all the archives are linked to below
let's move into some bitcoin drama bitcoin yenta stuff here gossip i i'm
not a big fan of this kind of thing but we got to talk about
it because it was news uh we'll start out with benny with this
this inx token and uh that their bitcoin they're dudes
in bitcoin who built uh who got involved with a
token on ethereum in order to start an exchange in a unique way
uh for me i mean it doesn't really i mean
and yet they had spoken not so great of ethereum in the past
it gives them a definitely let me it shows that ethereum is not a scam
in their eyes because they they acted upon it they
they're using it they're not so uh the btc better you can you can give your
take on this and what the heck is going on yeah so
um there's there's a level of nuance to this like i
like out the gate i'll say i i think the thing is trash i have no interest in it
whatsoever but um let's kind of look at what's
actually happening so the token is inx the idea is it's like effectively like
an exchange token and it's a fund raise
prior to launching the actual exchange i believe
the token itself uh like a lot of other exchange tokens not
only gets you uh discounts on trading fees and stuff
like that um and staking and all that kind of
stuff but it also gives you it's it's a real sec
regulated security that gives you um a percentage of the revenues
from the actual exchange when it launches now
for me like the ico boom the reason that one of the reasons that people were so
against it and thought it was so ridiculous was the tokens you were
buying were not securities they their icos is a play
on ipo initial public offering which would be
for a you know a security for a company um this icos were not
that um you got a token which carried basically no guarantees of
anything uh or any cash flows or there were promises of nothing essentially you
were buying a useless token that could or could not go up in value depending on
what happened with it and furthermore you could have the
company do quite well and the token be totally useless and those things were in
no way like tied to each other with this
it is indeed a token that's tied to the success of the business so at least
there's that however the individuals that that
advised on this and got a kickback of of buying the
token at a severely reduced price um
there are a number of them are noted like bitcoin maximalists
and so the main issue that i see is it's it's an erc20 token based on ethereum so
for anybody that said that ethereum is trash
the base layer itself is is questionable to use as a solid
infrastructure for anything if you're backing and promoting that
then there seems to be a conflict with what
you're saying and what you're doing um the security part of it i
i think there's some value in having like a security that you can hold
yourself um as opposed to leaving it with a
custodian because uh in my eyes that takes away the
ability for that security to be rehypothecated which is nice or
for those unsure what that means the ability of
fractional reserve to happen on your shares of a company so i find that to be
an interesting idea but francis bulliott had a very
excellent uh tweet thread on kind of looking into what people were
actually getting and in that thread he noted
that you're guaranteed a percentage of revenues
but there's no guarantee you'll actually ever get any revenues because
they have to first pay off any overhead that they've had to cover and
so far they're negative four million dollars
so that's got to be paid first before any kickbacks are paid to token holders
so don't expect major kickbacks anytime
soon uh so there's i mean there's a lot of
levels to this um i think all in all i just i don't care
about it i don't want it uh and i do find it kind of that
somebody would uh uh basically hate on aetherium so
much but then show a token that's an erc20 so i don't
know that's that's my hot take there very good
summary there uh juan gault i saw you retweeted
something about this from uh uh old other ugly old goat what's your
take on this yeah i mean i'm gonna take a a somewhat
contrarian position here to the general bitcoin community on this topic i think
i mean there's a lot of questions and i'm going to have some of these
prominent uh bitcoiners on the ugly logo show
soon to talk about the topic including bruce fenton next wednesday which i'm
looking forward to he's actually a security sort of
financial expert type guy so looking forward to that
um but i mean i think i'm very frustrated with people's response to
this because there's more things in the world
than in economies and in finance than money
like money is really important but there's more stuff than that
um you need you need investment you need capital to have capitalism
in order to have capitalism you need vehicles of investment
now the problem with the icos is that these companies were unregulated
unvetted not audited we didn't have
infrastructure to audit these companies and at least sort of keep them in check
and so on so they could it was an asymmetric trade
they would create a token out of nothing sell it pre-ic over here and then
give it to a global public with great shining marketing and then they could
just leave and oftentimes they were anonymous
oftentimes they had fake advisors and fake team members
that it was the the the stage was set for scams
but these guys have as far as i can tell and i'm no lawyer
they've gone through every step of legitimacy that our society has set up
in order to make these kind of investment vehicles
actually reasonably you know not not entirely unsafe and risky right
and i think that's that's a good thing first of all because it's sort of
it's taking it to the next level it's sort of doing it it's it's showing good
faith right second of all exchanges are
the most profitable business in bitcoin in crypto that has ever happened in the
whole history of this industry nobody else has made any money in this
industry it's only been exchanges and being four million to seven dollars
seven million dollars in in the hall right now that's nothing compared
to compared to what exchanges make if they are reasonably successful
i think the questions are why would you create
an ethereum token and who is able to buy this token what is the
barrier to entry here um i try to buy it just to see what
happens and i wasn't allowed from mexico so
apparently only the seven states that have approved their
licensing are are cleared for for purchase but but if
but apparently it theoretically they could go through the to the whole world
um that's where an area where i want to have more i want to get more answers and
more facts about that because why not just
the question remains why not just launch it on the stock market
their answer so far is that they want to do micro equities
so you could invest in the the the that ugly elon musk tesla truck
that i want to get but you don't have to invest in all of
tesla if you don't like the the the the speed
car right the racer i'm sorry i'm blacking out in the
names right now and so so that's in cybertrooper innovation the
fiber truck right and so that's the kind of innovation i
think that's interesting and as an exchange there's going to be a
lot of people that are going to come and bring their
their their their financial assets to it assuming that they actually get
regulated or that there's there's some sort of accountability to balance out
that asymmetry is that going to happen i don't know you
know is the team does the team to have what it takes
maybe right um i think the biggest the biggest kind of
issue i think is primarily i think samsung mao has been
the biggest anti-ethereum sort of proponent there
he looks like a hypocrite on this and in jameson
slob's tweet on the matter was like guaranteed share
profits that was the worst thing you could have said on a tweet
like like twits tweets already reduce all new ones to
400 and something characters and you're gonna add to the lack of duos by saying
guaranteed profits that's what pissed me off but so i think
there's definitely a lot of concerns on the marketing
but you know what we need like capitalism requires capital
i don't think i don't think we're gonna get anywhere by being sort of monetary
absolutists or something like that or monetary
socialists right like only bitcoin everything else illegal right like
come on guys you gotta we gotta we gotta we gotta find the new ones here and i
think that this reaction is to some degree the the fruit of
of a reactionary movement to the amount of scams that happened from ethereum
in the ico movement which is understandable but i think it's
important to to educate and bring new ones to the topic so i'm going to be
having the conversations with him on the little goat show
we'll see where we end up i'm i'm i'm just not taking out my pitchfork yet
that's basically where i'm at i i wanted to say regarding samson um
he i there was a reply to a tweet or something uh
and i think it was kind of tongue-in-cheek but he said something
along the lines of i only advised for these guys because lob
told me that they would migrate it to liquid asap
so i don't know how much of that was i think he was kind of like
joking there but anyways yeah well just a quick note on the
on the on the liquid thing their their explanation for why it's on ethereum is
that liquid didn't exist at the time that they started
doing the the compliance stuff which was like two three years ago so
maybe they will move it to liquid would you know what
with tone vase talked about that and i mean they got
sec approval by saying it's only ethereum blockchain if they
if they all of a sudden change where it is they're gonna be questions
i mean once you're playing in that regulated realm you just can't switch
and change and do this than the other uh before we get to andy here i want to
read a question from the audience and andy you can you can hit on this if you
wanted to i think the question for inx is the same
as it has been for everything done in ethereum why does this need a
blockchain good point all right uh andy you can comment on
that or just on the larger inx as a whole yeah so maybe i'll take i
will respond to that question and i'll and i'll give my two cents so
yeah why why indeed if you're going to have a
regulated security why bother with the blockchain now i
actually am in the camp that someday there's some
reasonable chance that most assets you know will trade on
some kind of decentralized protocol let's just say
the second thing i'll say is who cares which is
which is to say when i when i think about these days
and for the foreseeable future how i want to focus my time
my priority is the most important you know investment decision in this
whole space whatever however you want to label it for people
right now right is buy a bitcoin like get your allocation
get your hard money asset in your portfolio
and and you know and that's that's the thing to focus on
i do worry that i do worry about a repeat of 2017
which is all this noise around all these other assets
you know whether it's ethereum or anything else and
people exactly d5 people being distracted by these by
these shiny alternatives and and and new people coming into the
space and uh you know as bitstein says
everyone's a scammer and sort of basically allocating their
precious uh assets fiat most likely into things other than bitcoin you know
is there are these things interesting sure is
there money to be made if you're if you're a really great trader
yeah probably and so what percent of people is that
i don't know one percent right and everybody thinks that they can
you know make money in that casino or a lot of people do and i just i think
it's for most people it's a distraction and so when i you know when i think
about how i want to spend my time i want to spend time educating people
about bitcoin and getting whatever allocation is
appropriate for them and you know the rest to me is is is
mostly noise and distraction and maybe it's stuff that'll work
you know 10 years or more from now but um but that's my take
yeah it's this has gotten wrapped up in the uh
in twitter drama definitely i mean i think we could boil it down to it's it's
it's become just a huge story because some of the dudes were such big talkers
about ethereum uh not being so hot to trot and
you know now this happened so i get people don't get caught up in the drama
i think you you learn learn learn what's going on and another thing
keep it simple uh keep it simple these guys are complicating matters and that's
their business hey i i say compete don't complain they
can make their own ethereum token they can make their own exchange that's cool
uh i keep it simple just by holding that bitcoin just like you said don't get
distracted by those big there's new shiny things out there but
we're always going to have new and we're going to talk about d5 at the end of the
show too because it's just it's too it's too big to ignore but since we got
andy here right now uh it s something that's too big to
ignore is the barry silbert this dude is in like every corner of
cryptocurrency isn't he so now there's an article digital
currency group enters the bitcoin mining industry
everything i mean he's in every aspect and that's great i mean he's in motion
that's that's my take on it but uh what's your take here andy
yeah i agree i mean what you said is spot on
um and and two i guess to barry's credit i don't think he's he's hidden this
which is he wants his finger in every pie let's say in
crypto right and i think he means that broadly right
i mean i'll never forget when i think he
disclosed i don't remember if it was the parent
company dcg or one of the subsidiaries he disclosed you know what
assets they had on their balance sheet and you know the biggest was bitcoin but
there was i don't know five or six other ones this
was i think a few years ago and yeah i don't remember the latest
number but i think he's made something like 150
investments in the space broadly you know across
you know otc desks you know custody companies trading companies
you know tax prep i mean anything that touches
you know bitcoin or crypto he's in it so so this is no surprise now another thing
i will say is um i think it's great that
there is investment in mining um this is you know simultaneously a very important
piece of the puzzle obviously it's crucial secondly it's
it's pretty opaque right i mean it's i'll say
i'm no expert on the mining sector and the goings-on
and i think actually the information flow about mining in
general is probably among the worst in terms of you know
what's going on with exchanges and people and corporate participation and
the protocol and the devs and all that stuff mining is pretty opaque
um so i think it's great that there's capital flowing in the second thing is i
think it's great that there's capital flowing in
in not china right because for the future of bitcoin
it is important it is important that the hash rate gets
distributed more broadly right we need more nodes in different places
we need more hash power in different places we need more hash power you know
subject to different jurisdictions in different different geographies you
know using different types of energy i mean diversify diversify diversify all
of this decentralized decentralized so i think that's great i think it's
also interesting that um well we can peel i guess i'll say
this is you know they've got several um
announced areas of business one is what they call mining advisory
service uh another is equipment financing and procurement
and then the last is um what they call their foundry labs
which is maybe the biggest of the of the those three activities
but i think it's if i look at the second area which is
equipment financing and procurement this is pretty interesting and it's pretty
important because you know a mature industry
regardless of the industry but especially let's say a commodity
producing industry which is probably the closest analogy right for bitcoin mining
they're actually producing quote unquote you know the the
valuable monetary commodity which is bitcoin i mean it's not a perfect
analogy but but it's close um it is important that
these guys have access to financing and as we all know
the history of of the mining industry i mean it's it's been uh
you know it's the wild west uh slash piracy
um i mean it's just mayhem right and it's
you know it's been dominated by bit main and there's sort of been ebbing and
flowing of new entrants new companies coming in you
know getting competed out and one of the major problems for any
young industry is access to capital so these guys so so these guys actually
are able to provide financing whether it's you know equity capital
you know just buying a stake in these mining operations or better yet
whether it's debt financing which is usually much cheaper capital
right that's a major milestone to me in the
development of the industry um overall so look i think it's it's net positive
you know i love that peter thiel's investing you know in
in north american mining capacity you know i love what the upstream data guys
are doing i love you know i know there's some mines being
built in um in texas um of course you know there's stuff going on in
washington that's been a struggle i'm actually curious about the canadian
my my understanding of the canadian situation is it's been somewhat of an
uphill battle but but i think that more activity and
more funding and more maturation of the
mining sector or the mining industry in general
outside of china is is great yes
i i i agree and is is very silver too big to fail i mean no no
he is he is uh i give him all the credit in the world for getting into this
and good more miners and yeah upstream data dude
of course has been on our show before great dude benny knows him uh we'll move
on we'll move on to benny uh here what's
your take on this uh barry selbert and uh mining now
yeah i mean i i guess i don't have too much to add to uh what andy had there
but um like like he said it's it's positive
that you're starting to see a greater decentralization of mining
and it's proliferating across the globe um wherever it's most efficient
again talking about steve barber with upstream data
they're they're targeting kind of oil and gas uh natural gas flares and
and stranded stranded resources in in mid middle and northern alberta um
yeah so it is definitely cool to kind of see
uh the flood around the centralization of mining in china start to dissolve
we've kind of seen this i mean maybe kind of like a fall of
fall from grace for bit main um what everybody thought was going to be
like this absolute behemoth that nobody could overcome
very much seems to not be the case anymore
um you have people like even marty bent with
great american mining and the stuff that they're doing in the u.s
you're seeing a lot of it everywhere it makes sense that barry who
literally has his fingers like this all through everything
he's gonna want to get involved in that aspect of it um
it seems like barry's got this kind of like spray and pray
approach uh but lack of conviction in just bitcoin he's just kind of like
all the coins and he's just like mowing them down and trying to take
what he can um it was interesting the the pushback
on the the the ad that they put out because they
had such a positive reception for their first
uh dcg um grayscale investment uh drop gold
ad and then the second one they had like bitcoin and then like whatever trash
they had listed below it and everybody's um yeah but i mean barry
shilbert going to chill right so he's he's got to get in everything so
yeah i'm whatever good for him yes indeed all right uh juan gold you have
anything to add to this yeah i mean i think there's a point of
clarification um there's ellen allen silbert and then
there's barry silbert uh alan is barry's brother and alan is the one
that's actually working with inx i don't see anything about
barry silbert being involved though he might be an investor if
that's not you know named or something like that
um so it's a little different and alan was in my memory much more of
of a maximalist and took the right side of the fork when the drama happened
whereas barry silbert actually pushed segwit2x and all of his companies
push segwit2x so barry silbert has a question
reputation from that point of view even though it's been a few years
you know he's much more of a shit corner right so
so that's important but i mean other than that yeah i mean echo what
everybody else said you know it's great to have more bitcoin mining
in america i think we need a lot more of it um
think about this fact i was i was talking to um the owner of
a network of atms in arizona and he says that his biggest problem is
sourcing bitcoin locally because all of the bitcoin comes from
china and so you gotta you know you gotta go through multiple
connections or fly to china and build connections in order to buy the bitcoin
and how is he gonna flip it for cash in dollars and he's
only getting cash from atms so um i think one of the solutions is
producing bitcoin in the united states or in america
and that will that will actually improve the market here improve the liquidity
lower the the the prices in in sort of retail bitcoin
so there's a lot of good reasons to have bitcoin mining in
in in our side of the pond all right uh interesting that you brought up uh uh
the the the other silbert there tying it back into the uh
previous uh story indeed he is uh the brother silbert is involved with the
other story but barry is not now let's uh well i got one go out here
we're talking about big names let's talk about a fluff article from
today uh for about the winklevi because people
are going to want to talk about the winklebuy they
i i guess the question is uh do they say these statements just to get attention
to get marketing to get a clients or do they say it to get attention and
to to help bitcoin a combo of the two but yeah they got a
uh they got an article out there that bitcoin should hit 500 000 and that
to them it is it is the true gold and i i agree that bitcoin is uh is
the true gold i like that i like their anti-gold stance
uh or or the move on from gold stands i guess
but god the clickbait the 500 000 i mean oh god this is uh how this is never
going to end uh all the every big name out there from
max kaiser to winklevight they all got to state some huge tremendous number out
there so what what's your your latest take
here on the winklevi in their 500 000 dollar announcement
here yeah i mean all the possibilities of why
they're doing i would say just all of the above you know it's uh
it's it's great marketing it makes them look good
they're all these guys are like you know putting bets and trying to measure who
gets closer right so there's probably a game at that level
too and um and yeah they need they need whales
to come into their exchange to to um to gemini so
so they're they're they're selling they're selling bitcoin and that's fine
you know sell it i mean when is it gonna hit 500 000 i
mean i think it's not gonna be tomorrow
though i mean i don't think it could be tomorrow it could be
i had a dream i think i told you about this in another show i had a dream that
it was like the bitcoin was like seven thousand dollars and then i woke up the
next day and it was thirty thousand dollars
and like that could happen like i feel like that could actually happen
500 thousand will probably take a few years but like
what i'm expecting in the price is just a slow steady
rise and then maybe some some volatility swings once we break
the new all-time high and so on because they'll be we won't know where where the
roof is there but um it's exciting yeah i
i i just uh let's uh here's a guy ah well i was gonna we'll go to benny i was
gonna go to andy but benny you're familiar with uh uh the
crypto media out there and the love of click bait the love of
numbers what was this all about what's what's your take on that's just
screaming about 500 000 now i mean i will say that their prediction here is
probably going to be better timed than anything
tom lee on msb nbc has ever said in the history of time but
uh yeah it's definitely marketing right like they've got an exchange to run they
like they're they're doing their thing um the the reasoning for the
the anti-gold thing i think in the long term i i don't buy the like
elon musk is on a rocket ship to to all the asteroids
right away like that's not is that really in the near term to like
ruin the value proposition of gold probably not
like when i saw them sitting down with dave portney portnoy
and they they their one chance to get him to understand bitcoin and they said
well elon musk is gonna mine asteroids and so
gold is ruined right away like it was just
it was a bad chill um yeah so i don't buy that sure eventually
that might that that will probably be a thing uh
but i think in the short term it's more that
bitcoin fixes a number of problems that gold has
if they were going to attack gold the better way to do it is
we already had a gold standard we already had sound money
and due to some inefficiencies in gold that didn't work and so we're not going
to go back to a gold standard because we will just go off of it again
depending on who's in power with with bitcoin you have transportability and
you have auditability instantly from anybody
in the world and so that fixes the issues
the the um over reliance on custodians and the
lack of uh auditability of custodians when there are some uh that gold um
the issue that caused the dissolution of the gold standard and so
i just feel like their approach to attacking gold is
is pretty weak when you just say well asteroids are going to mind
sure eventually but yeah so yeah marketing
i guess that grabs some headlines uh because
it's that much more out there but um yeah that's pretty much my thoughts
on it all right andy 500 000 wicklevoss
bitcoin gold what's what's up yeah so agree with uh most of what you
guys all said um when it comes to price predictions i of
course uh mostly refer to this document which has a price prediction
um the prediction that i wrote in my book was four hundred thousand dollars
um but that was pre that was pre pandemic right that was published a year
ago and that was a that was a you know a
10-year price target at the time so now nine year i guess but i'm more
bullish now than i was then given the
you know acceleration of everything you know the increase in debt
the increase in money printing but it's in the same range
you know 400 000 500 000 you know similar order of magnitude
um i think that's right of course the time
i don't know if they gave a time did they give a timeline no
no no so um so you know who knows what the timeline will be you know will it
hit it in this bull market cycle i suspect not quite um so it might take
two cycles uh or two having cycles you know let's
say um but it's entirely
possible and it's you know sort of consistent with uh with what i've
you know put on on paper i would say i i do want to
i pointed this out before these dudes i've said it for a while
they want to become the world's first trillionaires and of course
a 500 thousand dollar bitcoin if they own one percent of all the bitcoin
they'd be getting close by that point i forgot i once calculated how much
bitcoin would have to be for them to be trillionaires
as well that's it that's right 500 000 bitcoin is 10 trillion and if they own
one percent of uh i guess uh
you know because i guess so they'd be well on their way
they'd be rolling their way with that yeah
yeah have asus already become a trillionaire for a moment
no no no no that's the company you know and
some of these companies they they're uh they're they're worth a trillion dollars
but the israelis around one he's arrested he's
close to 200.

He's still yeah that's what he's getting
close to 200 billion now so satoshi satoshi will be the first
trillionaire but uh but exactly all right may the day come soon
but dudes uh yeah the the the clickbait is strong
among among some out there take it easy you
you know that your one bitcoin equals one bitcoin
and in the future you'll be able to get a house with that bitcoin that's gonna
be great but uh like don't think well if it's not 500
000 by november 10 2023 i'm out of here okay now let's
let's go to a little bit beyond bitcoin here i've
decided like every week i'm gonna ask the
the panel about this it's such big news it seeps into everything
uh and we all lived through the ico insanity
of 2017 and and the d5 thing every week just seems like it's getting
closer to that and that it's going to go beyond that
and andy you've never been on the show
before so i i haven't gotten your take on
defy and if it will bring newbies in if it will be the next ico
and how i mean this this week there were plenty of examples
i mean people keep giving them out there like how
decentralized is this stuff i mean like you trust a third party with your
bitcoin and they give you rap bitcoin and i mean they could steal your
bitcoin i mean the the whole d part of the d5 doesn't
seem to really exist it seems to be a gimmick
and that some of these things are really centralized and have
or centralized points of values at least so
what's your latest take on on d5 it's a broad subject but it's it's something i
mean i want to get this down now so people
look you know in the future they see what we
we foresaw here so uh take it away andy yeah so look first disclaimer is i
haven't delved that far into most of these projects um so
you know i haven't really done my due diligence in uh in detail but my
senses is that you're you're you're spot on and
there's two levels right it's what are you building on top of which is ethereum
which is itself somewhat decentralized except for
you know everybody's running you know inferior nodes that sit on aws
and you know highly concentrated in terms of the holdings and
i don't get into all the details so so there's that level and then i think what
you're talking about is oh well then you've got you know whoever's put out
the token and whatever group is is you know controlling that
whether it's you know a handful of people or you know
one dev who just you know ships something quick and
as we know sometimes these things have critical bugs and they literally blow up
immediately as in the case of yams i think it was so
yeah i mean it's just it's it's all over the place
um these many of these things are are sort of definitional you know ponzi
games right i mean bitcoin itself is a pyramid
but at least uh it's been around a long time you know it's
it's totally transparent or as transparent as it could be in terms of
the you know the supply and how it's minted and all that stuff and
it doesn't have these weird uh feedback loops basically that cause
you to you know lock in collateral which generates a return you know which
which creates more collateral to lock in which
you know has this sort of feedback loop which can uh
grow rapidly and then unwind just as rapidly
so i think it's interesting and you know it's
i don't know is it fun to watch is it sad to watch some combination
um if i if i want to look for a silver lining or
you know something positive for bitcoin you know
news is news and you know going going into this or coming through this
having cycle and uh you know through the rest of the
year and into next year if history repeats not only will you
know bitcoin do well with the restricted
supply and incremental demand and all the buzz and stuff
and the news but if there's other buzz in crypto in general you know it adds
more fuel to the fire so i guess that's the uh
that's the positive take on it but no no question
plenty of people will be burned plenty of money will be lost
and uh you know yeah there's going to be a lot of people licking their wounds
uh after this one for sure i like you i like your positive take there at that
point though there's something i've talked about
before uh juan galt you've been over at uniswap uh
playing around with d5 what's your taste i'm just i'm just watching from the from
the outside eating popcorn and waiting for it to
you know burn up in flames i'm you know i'm hoping i'm hoping i
mean let's face it it's basically so first of all they're fundamentally
centralized and this is something that one of your
guests has talked about before here on the show um
all of these like the majority of these smart contracts that are
decentralized finance have a admin key controlled by the devs that lets them
freeze the account change the code do whatever they want to
the contract because this is the only way that ethereum
developers have managed to be able to create reasonably secure
contracts by centralizing them because all the decentralized ones
all that they're the big decentralized ones have all basically broken down or
cracked or you know or have to build this sort of
stock kind of structures with like democratic
states sort of structures right so so the way that they deal with
securities they centralize it and and then so you're trusting the developers
you're trusting the good faith of possibly
sometimes anonymous developers sometimes public developers so they're all
centralized there's nothing d about this it's all centralized this
should be called c5 just call him c5 no i i i oh you they're still sorry
about that i uh yeah it is it is ridiculous how
centralized are you talking about you said i had a guest on the show uh
chris bleck and his yeah absolutely chris is great chris is an ethereum fan
he's an ethereum fan but he tells the truth
he tells the truth about it and uh you guys can actually
check uh chris and juan were on the same show together
it was july the july the fifth of last year it looks like i had them on that
show actually they were on the show together
on march the 6th of this year march the 6th check out the archives
people tech ball dot com all right uh yeah chris is a
great person he tries to get he tries to get the
emotion out of the d5 he wants d5 to succeed but he calls it
out when he sees the centralized aspect so
uh you read my mind i mean that's that's basically what i was i was when i've
said it centralized i i go by what uh chris
says some of his recent tweets have been great
uh the other thing that i would say it's not clear to me that there's any kind of
company or project behind many of these like if there is you don't see it all
you see is the numbers go up right but if you're if you're lending
money to something you're lending for a specific business purpose
or for some project or something on the back but it doesn't seem like a lot of
these don't seem to have as far as again i'm not an insider but
like if they don't have anything behind them then really it's just a ponzi
and maybe that's what it is it's just a new version of a ponzi
um so i mean i think everybody knows this is not gonna end well
uh how far is it gonna grow i guess we'll see
all right uh btc benny what's your your take
oh this is ico bubble 2.0 for sure it's it's just what we're seeing from it
now is just it it's so reminiscent of what
we were seeing in ethereum in late 2016
ramping up towards what happened in 2017 and it's again like
everybody's been echoing a lot of people are gonna get burned
a lot of people are going to think that they've made a ton of money but it'll
just be on paper until something implodes some will
actually manage to get money out over time um
the interesting thing i find with all this is how much bitcoin is getting
locked up uh on this which to me would be sue i would never
do that but um zack voll just four hours ago tweeted out over 51
000 bitcoin are now tokenized on ethereum
that is four percent more than poloniex is holding
uh nearly half of what bittrex has more than half of what gemini has
and around 44 of what bitstamp has so there's a ton of bitcoin that is
technically tokenized on ethereum the interesting thing about it
is a lot of it isn't um so obviously there's there could be
vulnerabilities in these smart contracts and everything like that and that's
scary um not all of it is
not all of it are the bitcoin actually themselves held in
or hold up uh cryptographically in some sort of a smart contract
so a bunch of it is like with custodians so like rap bitcoin i believe that's
with bitco um and so they're holding those so at
least there's like if you're if you're already trusting
centralized finance at least there's a centralized like somewhat vetted uh
custodian at play there um but in the ones that are tied up in actual
smart contracts that scares the ever living hell out of me
um and then you have other ones where like i think it was ren btc that was the
one that chris black was tweeting about and they've like i saw
something where it was like a single bitcoin address that was holding like 9
000 bitcoin or something that was the deposit address for ren btc
it was something insane but like the the risk
with stuff like that are insane and and i think you're gonna see a good
number of people lose their bitcoin because of uh
just the ineptitude of some of these custodians that are supposedly
decentralized holding this bitcoin um yeah i don't
know i i think that we're going to see some major implosions i think it's gonna
be the ico uh boom and crash all over again
and i also think that the regulators are looking at this licking in their chops
but you know regulators move slow so it'll be after the crash of
defy that we see the regulators come in after
the fact and be like what did you do uh so yeah i don't know we'll see good
good point about the regulators that's what they did with uh
that's what that they came in on the ico thing at that point too
at that point so after it after it had crashed then they started really uh
coming in but i mean it's personal responsibility people if you can give up
your bitcoin for a freaking iou i mean it's it's on you dude
it's on you i i i think it's insane also i think it's absolutely insane that
people uh want to get on uniswap so much that
they're going to get turn their bitcoin into nothing but an iou this rap
bitcoin thing all right so uh let's let's uh
before we move on so one of the things that i've been saying i'm going to keep
sort of talking about this is that i don't
really fundamentally care about the platform that that bitcoin is
used in except for security questions right but
if if all of these d5 contracts are denominating or collateralizing their
debts in bitcoin if they're using if they're denominating
their contracts in bitcoin i don't fundamentally care if the
platform is centralized or decentralized from a more from an adoption perspective
this is exactly what we want this is actually we want people to start
using bitcoin even if it's centralized and yeah there's going to be security
concerns right now i don't want people to invest in ponzi's right but
but i think it's good it's a good sign for bitcoin adoption that all this money
is entering and it's actually like they could be denominated in
ethereum but they're using bitcoin instead because it's a better it's a
better currency that's good news and the same goes for
this inex if they start collateralizing these
security tokens and these these markets in bitcoin and they're
they're bitcoin denominated markets that's very good for bitcoin this is why
bitmex is such a great exchange for traders people are professionals
they see it because it's a bitcoin denominated
bitcoin collateralized futures exchange and that's very innovative it's very
powerful and so i hope to see more of that and i
think we we want to see the silver lining on that side of things but
yeah all right value your wealth in bitcoin even uh
the ethereum people do not they the d5 people do
now so we're at the end of the show here we're gonna get everybody's
conclusionary remarks any stories that were left out any
things they just they want to promote talk about
uh we'll start with btc sessions who of course has got an awesome channel that
you should watch all these dudes are below the twitter so
so follow them but take it away btc sessions what did i leave out or
anything you want to talk about yeah uh i don't know i i'm just
getting very very excited i i think we're on
the the cusp of another crazy uh year next year um
just the way things are shaping up again i can't say it enough but this is so
reminiscent of 2016.

Um but i mean for those people out there
that maybe weren't around for the craziness that was 2017 uh it's
very easy to get distracted by everything that's going on
so keep your wits about you uh try not to
to lose sats by um dumping them into something highly speculative
uh what you're holding uh you know the amount of bitcoin you're holding should
kind of reflect your understanding of it and same with
any investment and so if you see something and you hear about it in
passing and you don't understand it but it
sounds flashy maybe think twice before you dump your
sats in it um i did a a postmortem last year
on uh brian kelly was on cnbc and he did his
his uh perfect well-diversified crypto portfolio
and i so i did a post-mortem on what people's money did in that
and uh two years after that that segment had you went in with 10 grand
at that point to exactly his portfolio allocation
you would have had 13 grand but then when you broke it down and you looked
coin by coin what happened all of your gains were because of
bitcoin uh two coins basically kind of broke even maybe you
made like 200 bucks total and then the rest of the coins were
massive losses like 90 plus percent and when you looked at
your opportunity cost you ended up losing half of your bitcoin
whether you had just like bought bitcoin from the get go so
be value your wealth in sats that's that's
what i'll say that's how i'll end it so be careful
uh but excited for a big year upcoming yeah man that i remember that was a
great project you did i remember talking about
it there's too much complexity worship out there people need to come
they diversify for the sake of diversification bitcoin is my crypto
portfolio pound that like button you don't need to
have a freaking portfolio all right uh uh juan we'll save andy for last because
he's that he's uh the new the new guy here uh juan what's
what's your what's your thoughts on uh conclusionary thoughts anything you want
to promote yeah i mean i'm i'm working with ugly old goat i'm helping him build
out the website i'm going to go to say bitcoin trader he
trades bitcoin futures but he's trading other
things he actually made a gold play recently that's really interesting
and he's doing fantastic he's got a ton of free content on particularly
risk management how to manage your risk and how to
how to uh trade in a different way trade without
trying to predict the price without doing like
relying so much on technical analysis but instead relying on risk management
and he's doing fantastic he's the only guy in the market that publishes all his
trades and he's turned something like two
bitcoin to 30 bitcoin three times in a row now for three years
in a row um so he's absolutely crushing it you can
download his csv file if you become a subscriber and run his trades chart it
all out have a look at it uh the guy's like 70
he's an old wizard basically he's he used to be a gold
a gold bug and a gold activist back in the day and and so now he sees bitcoin
he's just gone fully behind bitcoin so i'm learning a
lot from him and uh i just sent you a link it's a 15
discount to the to the newsletter so it's very good for traders that are
looking to get to the next level to learn risk management
and if anybody that's interested in looking on trading just go to
go to the blog and then just read everything that's there he's a wealth of
knowledge i've learned a lot from him my training's improved a lot so
that's uh that's what i would what i'm focusing on these days
yeah uh has been on the show before people are familiar with him here
definitely he will scare you straight with some of
his stories check out the archives to hear that let
one of the oh man the stuff he's seen and again yeah he's a tree uh dudes you
you do what you want to do uh here the meister only got a strong
hand but i did i did link to the uh what you just sent me uh juan galt
there's no doubt we have gamblers here and everything and they wanna
they wanna learn about that and maybe they'll get scared straight by some of
the things he has to say all right but he he is a character a
really good guy and we've got so many unique beasts in this space and
it was great to meet him in person and you in person
and i've met benny in person haven't met this dude in person yet andy but you
never know you never know so we had to hear get
you're going to talk about your book i think
but to talk you know talk about your book talk about anything you wanted now
chances are good and i didn't give the disclaimer you know none of this is
investment advice uh obviously um i'm gonna key off what
uh you were just mentioning and what
sessions was saying too which is yeah i you know to my mind the most
important thing right now as an investor is to
have some bitcoin and uh what sessions was saying
about you know not getting too distracted about other
shiny things here's what's gonna happen in this bull market right uh you're
gonna get friends you're gonna get family they're
gonna start asking you questions hey i know you're into bitcoin or hey i
heard about you know abc xyz you know altcoin
what do you think about that that's your opportunity to
uh keep them on the straight and narrow right give them a copy of this thing
which is the investment thesis for bitcoin and
not the investment thesis for anything else yeah
good man i love it and so yeah that's my message is is
you know as part of a diversified portfolio owns some bitcoin
and that's like you know the most important thing um
and then of course i you know i stack my sats with swan bitcoin forward slash andy you can get 10 bucks free bitcoin
and uh for signing up and uh you know that's the
steady accumulation saving in bitcoin concept
um which i also am a fan of and uh i'm involved with swan obviously also
strong hand long term thinking that's what we talk about around here and dude
as i say every time i have a swan guy on which is like every week now
those dudes got tentacles all out in the community in a positive way
so many dudes just you know you go up you go on the shows and
you spread the word about the simple dca dollar cost averaging and just buying
bitcoin it's swan has been very quite a unique
beast this year of 2020.

Uh when we have the
uh year end awards we'll have to uh give give them a special one all right dudes
that is it that is the end of the show you get this weekend
thank you guest it has been a rocking great combination here
remember we have this show every single freaking friday who knows what time it
comes on it gets decided at you know a few days beforehand but you know
you can see the archives follow me on twitter at tech vault
uh new show here every day subscribe to the backup channel
uh tomorrow's show is gonna be a little bit different for beyond bitcoin we have
a guest oh it's gonna be surprise and all right so just tune in anyway shabbat
shalom everybody have a great weekend check out all the links follow all these
dudes on twitter and again i'm the bitcoinmeister i'm
adam meister the disrupt meister see you tomorrow see any next week see
you around thanks a lot dudes spread the

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