This week in Bitcoin- 3-6-2020- Market sickness? DeFi danger? Steemit takeover? Windfall game

Hello everyone this is adam meister the
bitcoinmeister the disrupt meister welcome to this week in bitcoin today is
March the 6th 2020 strong hand golden 80s of the 2020s having hype Bitcoin is
next Bitcoin in motion offended by selling conviction be a unique beast oh
yeah we've got three beasts here today one golf is in the house I was just
hanging out with him in Vegas Ken Bozak is here but he is got a real strong hand
I admired this man and we've got Chris black making his log anticipated return
to the show oh my things are gonna get wacky when Chris black is here he is
awesome he stands for a lot and he's not scared anything but before we get into
all the controversy before you pound that like button let's talk about the
big news of the week okay and there's just some disease out there of some sort
that people are panicking over and what does it mean for the cryptocurrency
space what does it mean for Bitcoin is 2020 just messed up now for ell markets
all over the world not just Bitcoin but I mean is everyone's gonna lock
themselves in their houses or work are we entering a golden age where
workforces will all work for home and become more efficient and spend online
and buy a lot of Bitcoin I like to look at the positive things have things
change in your own lives people oh we want to hear it or is it just a bunch of
cryptocurrency guys on Twitter giving medical advice is that is that just what
this all is so one tell us about this wound flu and what do you think is going
on in terms of Bitcoin and cryptocurrency and the expectations of
this year will there be a hi what's going on I mean I think I
think the the wool flu actually might be bad for bitcoins fundamentals in some
sense because the worse that it gets the more we're gonna want to actually just
buy canned food and and guns you know like like like I'm very bullish on
canned food right now especially the worse that the wolf Lou gets and bitcoin
is it's good but it's not necessarily gonna save you in this in this
environment yet it's not gold yet it's not silver yet it's not it's not
currency yet it might be good I don't know what impact it would have on
I mean if international commerce rise up because because China is on lockdown
that's also not necessarily good for Bitcoin if people I mean I think I don't
think is gonna I don't think the Commerce is gonna dry up there's
definitely like China the lockdown in China is a big deal and the other
countries are getting kind of quarantined as well but the overall
markets are still moving and things are still going around so that's kind of my
first take on that but my suspicion is that that's gonna affect any kind of
front running of the of the of the havening that's gonna happen so I don't
really expect price action like like price to start going up steadily until
the actual happening happens and this will I actually have you know but yeah
all right q do you before we move on to Chris here I just want to ask you do you
think this thing is serious do you think you think people a lot of people are
gonna die okay well are you worried a lot of healthy young man you're a
healthy young Europe you're I mean I saw your person you handed me this thing
here it's Boulevard so I mean right do you think well I think so from what I've
seen it is very contagious I think everybody's gonna get it I I think
that's inevitable everybody's gonna get this thing it's it's you know it's
reasonably deadly but not necessarily that much more deadly
than the flu or the common cold it's clear that it affects children and old
people the most it affects people that have certain conditions to most the the
healthier you are the better off you are you just gotta take care of yourself do
some that you know take care of your your immune system and basically shelter
this storm because I think everybody's gonna get it you just got it we just
gotta play it play it safe for the next few months all right dudes everybody do
some exercise and pound that like button Chris look at widest get Chris what's
what's your take on the economic impact I was gonna say it sounds like Juan
sounds like Trump and what Trump was saying I wonder if there's Magga under
that black sticker on your like we don't know what's gonna happen with where
we're not doctors right but like what's happening with the economy is
interesting yeah with a Fed rate cut yesterday
yeah half a percent which is significant when you think about how low we already
are and the impact that's having on regular people is you know like I just
did a video on my youtube channel released it today looking at the actual
interest rate that people are earning in their savings accounts right now so the
highest savings account interest rate you can get in the u.s.

Right now is
around 1.7 percent and that that's gonna start dropping in the next week to about
1.2 because of the rate cut yesterday inflation is 2% right so when you look
at the interest you're earning minus inflation you're negative so anybody
who's got money in their savings accounts is now at a negative interest
rate so will people start to look to crypto and specifically to stable coins
yes – perhaps preserve their wealth more
they're still gonna be subject to inflation with the stable coin but they
won't be subject to negative interest rates and if they use something like dye
they can earn 8% right and then 8% minus that 2% inflation leaves you with
six percent real interest rate so my question is how much is that going to
happen over the next it's not going to happen tomorrow but could it happen over
the next one to three years if we continue to see rate cuts and go down
into negative territory not just with real interest rates but with actual Fed
interest rates so that's my take on economic I like how you're slowly tying
in d5 this this is good we're getting ready for the we're getting ready for
the big talked about that in a second I do want to say you you you you logically
explain why it's not not fun to have negative interest rates and deal with
Fiat but I mean that's I don't know people are gonna learn by less than this
this time around I don't know I I hope that people that even if like two
percent of Americans understand what you just said and come into cryptocurrency
that would be great yes it's not complicated once you understand
inflation right because people see interest trickling into their savings
account you know and you get a few bucks a month and you see your balance going
up and it's like oh I must be making money I'm coming out net positive but
what they don't realize is two percent inflation completely obliterates that
return because the same two thousand dollars you have this year will buy less
next year in terms of groceries in terms of your car in terms of whatever and if
they're gonna start cutting rates even more because of the whoo flu which
they're predicting perhaps another 0.5 percent rate cut which would take us
down even farther into into actual into real negative returns when you look at
inflation and soon we're gonna be like Europe you don't aware in the u.s.

At
least where we have actual negative interest rates for money you hold in the
bank they want to incentivize spending the only escape from that is to get out
of Fiat and into either equities trading or some sort of you know additional
investment or into crypto and if you wanna you know be volatile and you want
to go into you know one of the cryptos that are volatile go for it or if you
want to preserve your dollar then use a stable point then all your wealth in
Bitcoin atomizer says ZIRP is coming we were already there once but a
negative Newark is gonna follow in the United States we will see it and yes I
don't I care but I'm prepared from there by value my wealth and Bitcoin all right
Ken what's your take on the the sickness and the economy etc etcetera
I'm vibing with Chrisman I think to add on what he was saying too is it's it's a
convenient distraction from a lot of things happening in the world that's the
tightly and they're gonna use it to get away with a lot of things like this
this interests cut and everything like they're good we're gonna see more and
more things that would be louder on the mainstream media if the Wu flu wasn't
there to kind of suffocate that information off of the Airways I think
the you know hashtag you know freedom for Hong Kong was probably one of the
biggest victims of the Wu flu you know that that passed away was that that that
meaning that moment that movement that was happening in China really is what
suffered the most and yeah and Chris I think you're right with destabilise van
I think people are looking at the solutions that Celsius is offering and
what stable Queens can provide and the hedge against you know the Fiat and the
banking industry and right now I think we're actually in a potential and I
talked about this in my podcast last week with my friends is we might see the
first cash cash drought in my lifetime because of this whoa flu
no they're disinfecting physical cash taking physical money out of circulation
this is way bigger in China that it is here in the US but we're probably going
to see an incentive to use cash in environments where there is a drought of
it so you might actually get more for your dollar than your stable coin
because the store may actually want your dollar so much they'll give you a
kickback or a reward for not using a debit card or cryptocurrency but for
using paper money because they need it in the till so I think that's
interesting thought to have like I never thought I would have saw a cash drought
in my lifetime to see like paper money limited in supply and actually have
more value than something you know like because it's scarce now know the good
Zimbabwe has something like I'll tell you that now let's uh I wanna there's a
question for me but I want to ask Ken this question but first of all crypto
mania sent twenty I think their Czech Republic coin thank you dude he says
happy Friday thank you now rubber seventy-three says to me but
I'm asking this to Ken because he trout was around – are you going to slow down
with the travel a Sikh Meister or Sikh ken won't help the crypto space bro as
soon as I got home from NFT NYC I've been sick since and I think that was
like – basically I've had this cold I haven't been able to shake for days now
uh yeah I think I will be coming back and I was actually just talking with my
brother about this yesterday you know my brother was like this all whoa flu
things blown way out of proportion I'm like no remember West Nile h1n1 bird flu
all these things that you know popped up that we're supposed to kill like 50% of
the world population like the Thanos snap you know like this wound flutes
they're telling you on the news the opposite of everything they told you
about West Nile bird flu swine flu all these things like you know Zika see it
was supposed to kill everybody but who died who guys and that's what I'm saying
this one they're saying don't worry about it it's fine all the other ones
they were telling you to worry when you had nothing to worry about
now that they're telling me not to worry I'm worrying well so it's travel you're
coming back on the travel nominee I'm gonna answer a question here for my sign
now first of all true if you guys check out the links below follow all these
guys on Twitter by the way but if you check out the links below I actually
discussed this at the end of my Wednesday show I believe if my travel
schedule and I was frustrated to hear that in in the Land of Israel where I'm
planning on spending three months that they're basically not letting anyone in
from Switzerland now what you probably say well what does that mean well before
I was to go to the Land of Israel I was going to spend 10 days in Switzerland
and go straight to Tel Aviv and that is supposed to happen on April the 30th so
I got an issue here I want to travel as much as I'm not scared at all
not at all I am a perfectly healthy young man I run 20 miles a week dude I
am in big freakin shape I'm ready to take I'm not scared of starting at all I
want to travel around the whole world but if I see some of these countries
implementing restrictions with travel and that's why I've air and that cuts
down on economic activity so much and that's why I am curious to see if these
countries are not going to be strict like Israel or if they're all going to
take this stance if all the countries start banning people from all the
countries that had roof loo once then no one's going anywhere
yeah people are just gonna travel around their own countries and that's bad for
the economy I I'm trying to think of ways that's good for Bitcoin but can't
talked about news stories that have been overtaken by this loulou thing and
obviously one of them was the Hong Kong thing but another thing I was expecting
a lot of having hyped stories that come out well the media probably won't be
talking about the having as much as they were well as I thought they would if
this thing is still going on at hyperspeed panic in the beginning of or
in the middle of April beginning of it let's see how things are at the
beginning of the April it's springtime things should get better I am an
optimist but dude I am very willing to travel anywhere I wish there was I said
this on Wednesday show I think there should be a country that just says we
don't care we'll take it anyone if you want to have an event here have an event
here where the anti whoa flu country we're the alpha-male country we will do
it all we're not scared and so if you're that country I will I will come to your
country I will do events there I wouldn't know if that's how it works my my Wednesday rant there but that was a
question so this is all over the news but guys calm down
be healthy just beep beep we stay in the Sun and exercise etc etc
okay funny because it sounds like the the Wu flu is like Trump's proverbial
wall you know it's shutting down you know traveling immigration it's like
that non-tangible wall he always wants it ah it could be it for some countries
it definitely is becoming a wall it definitely is and I'm gonna have to
figure out if I'm gonna have to cancel a trip to Switzerland in order to get into
Israel alright so but I I do I do what I don't want my travel schedule to be cut
down I have no plans to cut it down at all to answer the question okay so let
us we've got Chris here and Chris is a dude I respect a lot because he he likes
the defy stuff but he's willing to speak some defy truth and some people might
say it's not the truth but let let me read you one of Chris's quotes here
we're in it well key and then okay interfering with natural selection in
defy will always serve to weaken it allow the weak and vulnerable to fall by
the wayside watch the strong and resilient rise and
dominate well I like that take I I don't believe in bailouts okay III thought
that's when people got into cryptocurrency
but perhaps I'm I mean correct so we're talking about defy because you know I
know there are a lot of big point fans out there but this defy thing is
bringing people into the space there are a lot of big money the entities that are
curious about it and will they stick with d5 will begin the Bitcoin who knows
what will happen but it is something that affects us all so Chris take it
away with the defy truth haha well you know related to the to the tweet that
you said there we're kind of in an interesting time in
defy and in with aetherium in general I think because we like myself ice I came
into this whole thing from the Bitcoin point of view I'm a lifelong libertarian
who believes in economic Liberty and and wants to use crypto as a tool to
to get there and I saw right away with defy that defy is capable of providing
the financial services that were not we haven't seen on Bitcoin yet and yeah
there's a debate over whether we may see them soon but we haven't seen them yet
right so so I started looking at defy on aetherium
what I've come to see now is we're starting to get to a point where you
sort of have these these two worlds colliding between the etherium that
we've known for a long time you know which is the really strong developer
community the you know sort of rainbow and unicorns vibe right and and that's
actually – it's great you know it's it's a huge I mean there's thousands and
thousands and thousands of developers building on that platform and building
these financial services that actually work then on the other side you've got
this you know sort of crypto don't trust but verify mentality you know and
there's these two worlds colliding right now and so what we're seeing is there's
situations as I'm sure you guys have heard about where there's been money
that's either been exploited out of some of these smart contracts or you know
suspicious transactions last week we had a situation where we saw a transaction
where a stable coin swap where eighty nine thousand dollars went in but almost
half a million came out right so the questions start getting asked you know
how the heck did that happen what happened and we have to figure out you
know talk to the developer and figure out like what happened how did somebody
put in eighty nine thousand dollars and get out half a million somebody's got to
be paying that cost so the the tweet was really in reference to two things it's
reference to code so if we see week week code and weaknesses in protocols we need
to not prop them up not bail them out allow them to fall by the wayside and
let the strongest protocols and projects rise up because if we want a resilient
dphi ecosystem we gotta let it be resilient we can't prop up things that
are weak and then it also goes for taking criticism in the space and that's
something with the etherion community that they are not historically used to
you know but now that we've reached a billion dollars in locked value and who
knows in a year from now very well be ten billion dollars in defy
the criticism is gonna ramp up especially when you lose a million
dollars here and there right so uh-huh and it's not going to
necessarily come from inside the space it's going to come from bitcoiners it's
gonna come from government regulators it's gonna come from people who
existentially don't want this to happen so that's the current state of things
with that being said all this is is creating a more resilient space and my
goal is to create a defier that's trustless and that not to create myself
in that developer but to see it be created
you know trustless resilient system that people can actually it can actually be
at the level of the base layer of aetherium as far as trust Asmus I want
to point one thing out you said that the government and bitcoiners don't want
this let's drill down a little bit not I'm a Bitcoin er and I just I think it's
a great experiment doesn't affect me you know I I want it to do well I think when
other projects do well it's uh it's good publicity for the entire when they do
that it's bad publicity and if defy would have totally fall apart people
would just say Bitcoin fell apart I mean that that's that's the word worry and so
I am I am of the mentality you know don't destroy their RP I mean they're
playing big corners they just want to cerium to die etc which i think is
ridiculous I just just if you don't like it ignore
it this would compete don't complain that's what I say and I so I'm I that's
why I'm curious about this because I understand I've been in – I know I've
been in real estate before I know different different ways of financial
instruments and so I know people go they're gonna get into this aetherium
deep I think so why not have it be said well you know try to make it on the
up-and-up like you're trying to put it out there as so address the
sexualization aspect of it they're all sentiment it's all every project is
centralized to a certain extent and so the name is decentralized finance so
it's there's a little irony there yeah so I've I'm a big advocate for
transparency in the space and just over the past like a couple months we
come a long way I actually started a project called defy watch and there's a
website defy watch net removal and great yeah so what I did there was I started
to outline a lot of the centralization risks that comes with every project and
here's the general idea most of these projects have the ability with their
admin key they call it their private key which they're all in different
configurations but they can make upgrades they can make changes to these
smart contracts because you got to think of these things like applications that
might have bugs right that might have vulnerabilities so they retain the right
to be able to go in and fix it if something happens because they don't
want to lose their 50 million hundred million dollars in user deposits if a
bug is found and it has any software developer knows there's no such thing as
completely bug-free code it just doesn't exist right so that's what's happening
in the initial stages my take on this is okay that's okay if you give us a
roadmap to how you're going to get to the trust lessness and decentralization
that we want if you can't provide us with that roadmap if you can't tell us
how you're gonna get there and then when we hold your feet to the fire when you
don't do it if you don't continue down that path then you don't deserve to be
called decentralized finances and at the end of this whole thing if dreams
definitely gonna have centralized applications no doubt because it's too
easy to do and you know it's gonna happen it's gonna continue to happen
I want this small corner of aetherium to be carved out where we actually have
decentralized finance that is trustless that censorship resistant that's
unstoppable I want that little corner to be carved out for people actually care
about financial liberty who don't want like some developers to have control
over their life savings right that's what if they're if they're iam is fully
capable of doing that it's just I feel like we're gonna have to fight for it
over the next couple years alright guy Bennett said five bucks and he said
bring dphi on compete and don't complain anything that brings more people into
the Bitcoin overlay is great I will keep my Bitcoin strong hand yeah that's
that's a good attitude it's this innovation stuff instead of
worrying about the end of the world from some disease this is this kind of thing
I like to hear okay I think it's a positive and we'll
get more people spend well into alternative financial instruments before
we go I know Ken's got stuff to say about define one what's your take on all
this if you have a take yeah I mean I think you know I really like Mike's
Kaiser squad he said I would that there's no cap but there's no capitalism
without capital and capital means capital investment it means it means
people willing to risk the money to grow the economy and to invest and industry
and invest in in services and entrepreneurship and so on and in that
sense I think the spirit of defy is on point and I think big winners are
lagging on on financialization I think mainly because they're concerned with
other issues and because they're so much more risk-averse they're really trying
to make sure this thing is rock solid and there are some developments there I
can't say that I understand details of defy very much but I understand the
fundamentals of aetherium and you know I have I have fingers to those questions
that I have about defy that maybe you can give me a couple of years or no
questions answers on this chris is there K YC on on on defy like are you are you
you know do you have to like login with coinbase or something like that
generally no none of the the proper defy apps have kyc or any kind of identity
involved you log in typically with a web three wallet like meta mask I don't know
if you've ever used it before yeah okay so it allows you to log in just with
that hi my take on kyc is if there's kyc you are no longer defy your net you
can't even be close to consider d5 i could kill your censorship resistance
and they fight is giving people loans that right would like and then charging
interest yes okay so here's the here's the thing that I'm concerned about right
like it's hard enough to give a loan knowing the person and make that
profitable right I traditionally the banking sector the private banking
center evolved out of banks taking thrill
investing in companies and looking for a return right and to generally they would
invest in the more conservative companies right it's that's that's risky
enough knowing your customer right and I understand that KY sees you know it's
bad for in for terrible for privacy and and I'm no advocate of kyc but that's
hard enough if you can create you know many sockpuppets online and and enforce
a complete identity and then get a defy loan then yeah you're gonna get exploits
I think that's that's gonna be it's good to whatever degree how they mitigate
that I'm not I'm not really sure a lot of loans have been collateralized over
the past in collateral it's a it's a very important way to to hedge trust you
know like so instead of being fully trust that you you trust 20-30 percent
and think manage risk that way so that's one of my concerns but I think I think
it's great I think that this period of it is great and I think I think
financing capital capital lending in capitalism and in private banking those
have to evolve out of this what the green needs to be a hundred percent
decentralized I don't know I think the you know the less cost involved the
better but some degree I think this is gonna have to merge with society and
merge with the legality of things so the loans and I don't want to do getting up
too much here sure I have a YouTube channel youtube.com slash Chris black
where I have about 50 videos on this topic so I encourage everybody to check
it out even if you don't plan to use it it's good to learn every loan on defy
right now is over collateralized so that's kind of the secret sauce of
what's happening right now with the loans on defy every single loan is is
over collateralized and algorithmically programmatically liquidated if at a
certain point right so you put in for instance two 'if you borrow a hundred
die you know and if your eath drops too much in value you get liquidated and
really in this context when you're just dealing with
with crypto like this the the main use case for cuz that's probably what your
things like why would anybody want to do that is to leverage trade right because
you can with that hundred died you can buy more eat so you can get more
exposure and create that for yourself without having to use an exchange down
the road is that going to change are we going to have other ways to leverage
over collateralized loans down the road maybe I don't know there there are no
under collateralized or no collateral loans yet people are advertising that
they're trying to develop this this type thing I don't believe it's possible
without what you said without identity and kose I'm tied to it and keep this in
mind too in in traditional life there's no there's really no such thing as in
under collateralized loan when you consider your reputation as collateral
you know and if you don't pay your credit card bill yeah you're you don't
have to financially pay it if you file bankruptcy but your reputation gets cut
in half your financial reputation your credit score etc so we don't have that
concept in defy yet but maybe down the road I mean who knows what's gonna come
in a couple of years people are also working on decentralized identity so but
right now everything is over collateralized so that eliminates the
risk that the vulnerabilities that are happening are more code based or people
taking advantage of these weird economies that have been built to sort
of front run and to do different things that are affecting the algorithms
involved yeah yeah that's fair enough I mean I get that make sense in Bitcoin
you know if you want to get leverage you you know we have things like again
they're centralized but you have bid mix right it's just a little some big kind
of bin mix and then you let you leverage you leverage that right so it is
centralized I get I get that you guys are getting are building building more
decentralized solutions more complex solutions anyway I mean I have Gerald
sort of risk-averse concerns that sure we're gonna hear from big burners but I
think generally developing a lending market in this industry is a good thing
because being an entrepreneur and Bitcoin encrypt this hard and it's
really tough and if you don't have capital to SEMA worse right but
yeah that's what the other thing is like and I wish we talked about steam it
earlier because this proof of stake stuff we're starting to see the the
downside of it especially with steam it and that's a really fascinating drama so
maybe we can talk a little bit about that and come back to but we are gonna
you're gonna talk about that one first of all pound that like button people
you're hearing some stuff you don't hear anywhere else can what you you've been
silent here I'm sure you've got some new fire stuff to say commentary well hit
the nail on the head man like again Chris I actually want to see what you
think of this you know you said that these defies you know these these these
defies our decentralized and and don't have to worry about like you know
developer code and stuff like that right they well what do you mean they don't
have to worry about the code well like you know a developer isn't in like
charge of like you know the the centralized exchange like a coin base or
finance or whatever but I do worry about like the centralization of the
blockchain these D fights are being built ones like ethereal you know all
these defies are being built on a centralized you know tech blockchain
ethereal only they're not you know working on being multi chain fasted or
working on other hedges against the theorem so if there were a bug and it
theorem like you mentioned earlier there is no bug free code so the bug that we
haven't found yet in ethereal that will expose the thief i markets to XYZ issues
that will occur haven't been thought out yet I'm just wondering like what other
blonde chains besides the theorem do you think are a catalyst to host a viable
defy okay let me address a couple things so first the current defy exchanges and
products that that exist almost all of them are right now as of today pretty
centralized in the fact that they all have all the core teams that have
developed them if we retain like I said before that admin key that gives them
the ability to fix bugs okay but that key also gives them the ability to
radically change the code and divert funds and there's all kinds of things
they could potentially do they can't do it with the existing code but they can
change the code to whatever they now there's mechanisms in place for
instance a lot of them have a time delay so they want to increase the trust that
you have to have unfortunately by adding a delay so if they submitted a code
upgrade compound for instance I believe has a three-day delay where anybody can
examine that code change on the blockchain before it goes into effect so
there's stuff they're trying to do to mitigate the trust that you need but
they are somewhat centralized but again like with compound there they just
announced their decentralizing their whole platform they're gonna burn that
key they're gonna do a decentralized governance system kind of like Maker Dao
where users hold governance tokens and can vote on issues and code changes and
stuff like that doesn't that's up to some form of trust oh and then burning
that key like we have to trust that they did that is there a way okay how would
we verify that defy change has burned their admin keys and is truly set to the
wilds all of the code is open source and transparent on the blockchain so you can
read the code you can see the admin key you can see the backdoors that are coded
in you can see once they eliminate them you can verify that anybody who can read
solidity is able to verify that information and that's all very few
people though right I mean again that's almost like centralized uh do I are
right like tens of thousands of aetherium I'm just I mean how many how
many people had eyes on the Dell and that bug still got through is what I
worry about when these thief eyes are in issues one is can you verify the code
the admin key has been pulled and the answer that is yes if you're talking
about a bug or some kind of you know most of the almost all the bugs that are
found there first of all those companies with audit companies all they do they're
independent auditors of code okay the bugs that they typically find
are not like hidden little backdoors as much as they are where different parts
of the code interact with each other in unexpected ways okay so they're trying
every different combination of what you can do to make sure that that something
bad is not going to happen now even though they do that it's not perfect
right because people are able to figure out different ways to me
the economies and because all the defy protocols can be plugged into one
another permissionless Li you can create some really crazy stuff right that
nobody ever thought of like there's a new concept called a flash loan that
really just came to light over the past few months even though it's been around
a little longer but the whole idea is there's these lending pools like
compound in Ave and somebody can write a transaction where they can with no
collateral borrow any amount of crypto from one of these lending pools so let's
say you want to borrow a hundred thousand dollars the transaction begins
with you borrowing that money it ends with you repaying it all in one
transaction in between you can do anything you want you could you could
run some arbitrage you can trade here and there as long as you begin and end
with the same amount you can keep the profit okay so people are coming up
great and and the craziest part of that is if you if you can't do it all in one
transaction the transaction never happened so it's like one of those
Schrodinger's cat things right so it's like it reverts the whole transaction
like it so it's we're seeing some stuff right now that that breaks your head
right as far as like what's possible and now we have to see how people are going
to abused it and this is those flashes exactly what I do i won that race every
year turning in my mind you know and those plates you heard about over the
last few weeks we're using this technology so you know now we're seeing
okay we need to bone up the code here and there and here and there you know
it's like we have to take these things into consideration but it's like the
Wild West right so it's like nobody could have even thought about this stuff
six months ago because it didn't exist you know so okay so that addresses that
and then just to the etherium question I definitely am not the one to stand up
and say aetherium is as decentralizes bitcoin okay it's a spectrum right
there's centralized there's decentralized and there's everything in
between the question is you know with all the hacks we've seen how many of
them have involved the base layer how many of them have involved actual
weaknesses with the etherion base layer and has pretty much been zero because
everything that been hacked has been built on top of it
okay so it's bit Alban bugs in the code built on top so the base layer just
because it's been around for so long and has supported so much in my opinion is
trustworthy is it as decentralized as Bitcoin no okay but Bitcoin simply can't
support the stuff that we're building there if this is a programmable Bitcoin
it's gonna come with a new set of risks that's my perspective on it again
there's like RSK and there's other stuff like that that my surface arguably even
more centralized I don't know you know but uh you know it's if we were Satoshi
to come back out of the woodwork and build the decentralized exchange that
these centralized currencies deserve you know what I mean like the Bitcoin of
these centralized exchanges not just the Bitcoin of Bitcoin yeah I hear you and
and one more note on that right now as we speak and probably being released in
the next few weeks are these bridges between Bitcoin and etherium you know so
we've already had atomic swaps where you can swap the coin over to a theorem and
back and forth atomically without an exchange that exists already it's not
optimized but it's you can do it but now we're starting to see these these
bridges where you'll be able to send Bitcoin to a Bitcoin address and
suddenly it appears on aetherium in a tokenized form okay and once it appears
on a theorem you can do anything and defy with it so you can you can lend you
can borrow you can use the exchanges there's there's already leveraged
trading they're ramping up the frequency on a lot of the trading decentralized
exchanges so this stuff is all happening so um I hear what you're saying about
the ultimate in decentralized block chains right is so so Toshi's blockchain
I get it but as of today what we have right now aetherium is the best we can
possibly get right now it is the best I don't know whether it's like ego old or
one of those things like Bitcoin used to become Bitcoin I feel like all these D
files are just going to become very small pieces in the PI that will be the
decentralized exchange of the future a really good chance of that you know
especially with the new bridges being built
the question is will a theorem just become the financial a player of Bitcoin
which is a real possibility you know but I mean we just don't know how it's gonna
go I am a blockchain agnostic person I'm not liking aetherium like advocate I'm a
defy advocate I believe bitcoin is the decentralized money but you need
decentralized financial services otherwise you're stuck using centralized
financial services I just want a question that that there's tens of
thousands of aetherium developers I'm doing some Google searches right now
there's no source for that there's headlines around it but there's I
haven't found the source tens of thousands of etherion developers I can
tell you I just went to East Enver it was my first a theory a moment
conference I've ever been to and there was 2,000 developers there it blew my
mind you know if I was walking around this huge space that they had rainbows
here unicorn there right and it's like you there was four floors full floors of
this like rec space tables tables tables I was like where did all these people
come from they were all hacking on aetherium in that space alone this week
was ECC in Paris where they had even more people I believe in the hackathon
there are there's there's a lot of aetherium developers out there okay but
then thousands like maybe there maybe 20,000 you know she said well that that
is tens of thousands or portion of a hundred thousand I guess right I didn't
say a hundred thousand you know there's a mission to get a million developers
eventually but there they're nowhere close to that yet in defy I can tell you
this indie fight just as as far as users go there's about there's reported about
forty or fifty thousand people interacting with the defy protocols I
might get my best guesses about maybe half of them are developers you know and
the other half are actually people like me who come in to use it so but yeah
there's a lot of etherion developers people don't realize how big this
community is I think there's also misconceptions around bitcoins capacity
to do smart contracts and we're hopefully gonna see a lot more of that
in the near future but most of the focus depending on the lighting network and on
this sort of software that's coming to Bitcoin
in lighting is more contracts there's a lot of complex stuff lightning is in
Bitcoin now yeah it is nobody nominated in Bitcoin it uses Big Canoe Bitcoin
that you can redeem for Bitcoin bro but lightning is not Bitcoin that's why that
remain lightning otherwise it would just be called Bitcoin come on let me call it
is gonna be called Bitcoin that's interesting that we didn't agree
on this like I don't understand why I strongly disagree on this you're looking
collateralizing bitcoin is fully collateralized Bitcoin and then you can
be PC to my BTC wallet it's not BTC I'm done with the conversation bro I think I
don't want to lose your friend over this but like it's not the coin that's
interesting because with the new the new tokenized versions of Bitcoin on a
theorem I'm talking about you actually you will be able to do exactly that
yeah it'll be able to send the Bitcoin trustless Bitcoin token directly to a
Bitcoin address there's stuff change we'll flip it for a theory or whatever
just like if you send if you send Bitcoin to whether of Satoshi it will
flip it automatically for lightning you know and you can flip it from lightning
to Bitcoin or you can send lightning to a Bitcoin wallet through whatever
Satoshi so yeah you know clear do you have to interesting a third party but
you can program that in your own node and it's the same thing with ethereal
these bridges are not gonna be entirely trusted so it's gonna be collateralized
multisig in the backend because you have to you have to yeah you have to
collateralize the Bitcoin and then create a token that's backed by it I
mean maybe you can do that on an ethereal contract I don't know but I
guess the key problem right so how they centralized these things are gonna be I
think it's to some degree a red herring I think that you know like think about
it this is analogous to the gun debate in the United States and I'm sort of
bringing in a huge topic but like here's the thing you you give everybody guns
and then there's centralized risk that there are so many actually
gun running around but it means that a bit you're not putting the risk on it
the system that the government has to save you and if the government goes dark
and they take you over ready with something like like like small
centralized banks right private banking that's private makes it you're trusting
but they're all small and you're not you're not putting the risk on the
system right in the current system there's this massive systemic risk
because there's a massive had a hierarchy of federally federal Fiat that
can bail out the banks you know on a bit couldn't standard or the way that it
used to be in the gold standard there's a bunch of private banks that nobody
could bail out so if you fuck it up you lose the money right if you if you make
bad loans you're taking the hit you have to manage that risk personally and that
requires full human intelligence and so I think that's the way that is probably
gonna end up being again because AI it's not gonna be capable of doing for a long
time and unless you're doing kyc the stock
pop up socket accounts are gonna keep milking the bugs in this system and if
you're not if you're not under collateralizing alone then who's loaning
the money like what's the point you know hey YC is gonna look a lot different in
the future of a successful defy adoption bro
and that I think I think you know like how much can you madam is synonymous kyc
you know I think what see I was really interesting
yes identity that's being worked on but I'll tell you this the main reason I I
am excited about this field is because I believe that any form of centralized
finance is always gonna fall under the thumb of the government and under the
thumb of regulations and central banks and I believe the only way out of that
is if we create more bitcoins you know and I don't mean more bitcoins but more
things in the spirit of Bitcoin we need more pseudonymous code release on
aetherium that's just sort of dropped and then let people run with it because
a big problem that we have is the admin keys a lot of them are being held by
corporations and people that are based in the US and if the government wants to
step in and say you know what you have to alter your code in order to meet our
regulations they are capable of doing it they will do it if they don't do it
they'll go to right so great if they burn that key and
they can't do it they go to jail right I don't have a burning because if they do
and they can't if they are held accountable for what the technology is
that they created that they let loose into the world that they can no longer
control they could be held accountable that's why Satoshi she's never gonna
come forward to be like I did that Bitcoin thing because the first thing
the US government's gonna be like hey remember Silk Road yeah jail
yep I mean if you look at like ether Delta type situation you know there's
there's I don't know if that's really clear yet but I think you're right then
that there's a good chance of that and that's why I I'm not completely
convinced that any of the current projects are gonna meet the standards I
have for dissent I was a very say I know I'm not say I'm not ruling them out but
I'm not completely convinced because they haven't fully shown me that they're
willing to get their set compound has come the farthest in dissent they're
about to decentralize their governance and they're gonna split up the
governance tokens but the question is will there still be a handful of people
at the top who if they got together could make the changes needed to meet
those regulations um but like I said before I think the most exciting stuff
is yet to come and what I'm trying to do is inspire
developers who are just coming into this space to think about these issues right
up front right and to think about okay what can I build build that I don't need
to put my name on earth at I can just set loose you know maybe it's not a huge
ecosystem like compound maybe it's small tools here and there these primitives
that kind of can serve as this a player for people to build on top of there's a
lot of stuff that could happen in the next year or two but my goal personally
is really to build transparency in the space so people just a final thing or
like people my biggest issue is people don't see this stuff like users don't
see what we're talking about right now they think a lot of people think
compound and Ave and all these these things are using on aetherium are just
as decentralized as Bitcoin okay that's just because people don't know what
questions to ask so on my youtube channel I try to reveal like I just put
a video up today about maker Dow and died and I put a whole section in there
about risk about the possible risks I linked to
a speech from one of the maker doubt people about risk because every time I
talk about this if I want people to know the risks that come with centralized
protocols and products because I want to inspire people to build the
decentralized and I think that's what's going to come next and it's probably
gonna happen on aetherium okay whether you like it or not because
it's the best place for it to happen I can't think you asked before what
other chains are there I haven't seen any other chains that meet the level of
decentralization of a theorem even if you don't think it's fully as
decentralizes Bitcoin it's the most it's the closest we've got right now and I'm
not the guy who's gonna go out there and build a new chain right so it's like
that's my take on it I'm excited about what's to come
all right very very positive let's uh let's move to what Juan wanted to say
about steam it because this is people were actually asking about you in the
chat yeah steam it is really interesting so I'll kind of break down this story a
little bit and I might get some of the terms incorrectly here I'm gonna make
sure I get the right terms but basically Tron bought out said that he bought a
blockchain which is just ridiculous right and say and then what actually
happened is he bought out steam Inc I think or steam at Inc the steam it Inc
is a corporation I'm not sure where they're based exactly but it's a
corporation that owns the domain name steam accom it also owns a portion I
like a significant founders share that they've been using to kind of like help
the community here and there over the years right well that's what they bought
and they bought starting IP but most of it if you know the steam launching is
actually released in open source under an MIT license so most of it is open
source there's not a like not all of it is IP right and so and so that's what
that's what that's what that's what Tron bought that's what just in some sort of
you know Empire purchased right and and so in retaliation to that and I'm not
sure exactly why this happened right I guess i steam it people were like whoa
whoa whoa slow the fuck down and and it concerned I guess about
but Justin might do I'm not sure what triggered it but but the steamy
community and because it's a delegate a proof of stake system where they're sort
of like proof of stake voting that elects I think's 21 nodes to be the
guardians of the block shake the block producers the the block cosigner so to
speak right missus the witnesses thank you they you know a lot of them were
like okay we're just gonna Soph for the lion's share by steam I think I'm just
gonna Soph for it that into not being useful because we're afraid that that
manager is gonna start messing with the natural consensus of like the organic
consensus of steamin right well in retaliation to that Justin so not only
voted in a bunch of socket witnesses but through his influence got by Nance hobby
in Polonius apparently he owns Polonius then there and then Hobie I'm not sure
where relationship is there and they got violence and all them to new to use
consumer fonts in their exchanges consume users teammates lock them into a
stats the steam in my smart contract in order to be able to vote for the
delegates that just in song wanted and that way he he basically undid the
software right so now they're kind of like consensus deadlock where there's no
there's no majority that has a unified vision and all the money that was on the
students changes all the few thousand students changes is locked up in a 13
month contract that that waiting weeks 13 week contract where the money can't
be withdrawn it has to be withdrawn you know 113th a week at a time right so now
this exchanges have this liquidity risk where all the steam and community of
course is pissed and so they're if they would say they try to withdraw their
steam it that steam it is now gonna be available for withdrawal so what does
the exchange have to do were they're gonna have to buy it on the market and
sell it right and that's gonna start creating liquidity an accounting balance
problems for the exchanges so that's the mad potato that they're trying to
resolve right now I just listened to a well
portion of a way public kind of Town Hall yesterday were just in some was and
his guy Roy Wood they were talking with some of the witnesses and they're trying
to like figure this out and as far as I can tell just this our top priority is
hard-working steam it out of that forty thirteen week time lock so that he can
bail out the exchanges and the developers are like best-case scenario
you need a month you get four weeks you know you we can reduce it to four weeks
best-case scenario possibly theoretically but it's not safe too hard
for can break this fundamental or a bit of a theory of the of the steam a
consensus right so the exchanges are gonna bite the bullet here just as it's
gonna it's in a you know an embarrassing position which is very bad for the
Chinese you shouldn't be embarrassed as a Chinese person and I mean I think it's
it's it's really a great example of a not just the the weakness of proof of
stake in in a market that with massive centralization of wealth in exchanges
but also we can still delegate a proof of stake right in and how you know again
we could bring it back to the theorem but like just elegant proof of stake
alone it's it gets very political sometimes and that's that's what we're
seeing right now so home you know going forward if they were there working there
trying to find a peaceful path long story short the current the current
demands from this d'emic community is that Tron forego their voting rights of
their shares and make some donations to the Steam Community funds to sort of
fund development and such and then just inside just wants to bail out the
exchanges because he probably like from what I heard from finance finance was
like oh we thought this was like a regular update type of thing which
sounds like nonsense right but they're trying to like not take the heat on it I
think they're gonna take some heat I think they're gonna they're gonna pay
the the consequences of playing politics in crypto and and it's very analogous to
them beacon cash become fort because because it was this sort of corporate
consensus that was parallel to the grassroot consensus and that tension is
being felt and this is that you know running anode does help
grant approval steak is different and they actually you know it was a proof of
steak fork but anyway very very entertaining drama and I'm paying and
trying to keep an eye on it well if you want to pay attention to this more
closely with probably the toppest of the top tier information I will say I've
been following a growed 0:01 that's all right that's a GG r OE d zero zero one
on Twitter highly recommend you follow aggro'd zero zero one for information on
this and is the founder of Splinter Lance Lance steam engine the steam key
chain I mean literally everything built on steam besides steam it this guy
helped build so I've been following him very very closely the past few days man
and yeah you pretty much hit it all in the head bro I mean I think this is
beautiful though I mean maybe Chris or Adam may disagree but I think this is
beautiful I love seeing this but it's not because
this is exactly how it should be playing out everything that's happening the way
it's happening is the only way it was ever gonna happen I mean you know people
didn't that the people that didn't realize that steam it was a centralized
corporation utilizing a decentralized technology that was the steam blockchain
I I think you know it's Darwinism but the way that the governance model the
politics is playing out I think it's beautiful
it will be historic people will look back at this much like nadao in the
Bitcoin bch hard fork and this will be a precedent for what to expect as a
catalyst for future events in proof of snaking governance environments and
again I think it's beautiful however it happens positive or negative
for either side it's good for the industry as a whole that it is happening
in general yeah this is precedent setting the game theories being hard
tested with high stakes on on on steam it and this is gonna have big impact on
on Howie OS for example if they're doing anything still I don't really ever hear
about them anymore how they think about their the game theory but it's also
affect the theorems game theory because as far as I understand and again the
things seem to you know change relatively fast in a theorem but you
know if you're enforcing to proof of stake model where they're using
collateralised proof of stake in order to achieve some kind of consensus then
yeah that money on the exchanges is gonna be part of the BET right and not
only like today it's it's some very ambitious just in song kind of playing
power games and in in consolidating centralized shit coins together like a
grain you know kangas Genghis Khan of shit coins you know but tomorrow it
might be government right like like the regulators well just could be like hey
you can have support this stuff work right and that's why I think what's
happening in India is very interesting to to see the bank try to fight with the
the Supreme Court I'm like I never really would have thought banks thought
they had so much power when it came to government and the court but damn india
has proved it's great wise right right yeah their own Supreme Court I'd like the experiment – I'm with Ken
I'm like but I the people it's it's interesting to see how this is all gonna
play out but what's it agro guys I want to look in my room it's on Twitter it's
a G G ro e D 0 0 1 ok oh there he is ok I'll add that under the notes Chris do
you have anything to say about all this stuff because it's a little bit of
cerium stuff in there yeah I mean well it's it's a little it does get a lot
outside of my scope to be honest with you but one thing that I did learn that
was a key difference I believe between the try the esteemeth situation and
aetherium is that with proof of stake as the theory was planning it the daters
are only gonna be verifying the blocks they're not going to be involved in
governance right so yes they could support a fork but then all the other
nodes would have to support that fork okay and with the
size of aetherium it's pretty unlikely that somebody would be able to get a
majority fork that's my understanding of it so and and I know that this has been
coming a lot of italic and I've been following his tweets about it he's
always making a point consistently to say that proof of stake as etherion
planning it does not equal the coin voting that's sort of what has been
going on here and causing a lot of the problems so again it's a little outside
of my scope I might have said something wrong there but I am seeing that there
is a difference in what's being talked about with steam it versus what
aetherium is actually planning so I encourage everybody to do their own
research on it now I want to say with the steam people who live there if there
really are steam fans out there that keep their steam on in exchange I mean
this is what you get mad you gave the exchanges power is so control your own
private key whatever darn coin you have you should have Bitcoin people but for
some reason if you're valuing your wealth and steam I can't believe you're
keeping it on there forget on the on Finance and because this is what it
leads to you gave them a centralization a risk on top of centralization risk yes
like Quinn Quinn base is in possession of you know it's it's a lot I look at
these exchanges and try to see if they have like a 30 40 percent majority of a
lot of these coins and you be you'd be shocked to find out how many have a
significant stake in these games you change to hold their coins now you
know I think they're creating centralized you know mama lists in this
space and dwindling their individual powers man's sweetness and how many how
many like point does a coin base add I believe it's about 50 percent fifty
seven percent I need I need some stats I'm gonna do some research there that
yeah yeah coin base is one of the largest like coin holders period like
but fifty percent of all I mean that would be amazing
yeah well look at their look at their uh you could go back to twenty eighteen
twenty seven to twenty eighteen run where we saw you know what three hundred
thousand new people joining Queen base every month you know they were having
millions of people with in quarters of their year joining and
yeah it's not and it's not without possibility to see this happening and
more and more as this space goes on with these you know coins as they come out
we'll see become centralized do to exchange power you know and this is why
I love watching what's happening with steam right now and and and Justin Sun
and everything is this is going to be that presidential momentous history
we're gonna be like the steam it versus Tron you know with like a court of law
mention when things happen or or expect it to happen because you know this is
going to be played out in other blockchains this isn't just a steam
issue or a steaming issue this isn't you know centralized to just their
blockchain for their governance model this is all of the pot chains that use
this governance model have a potential outcome of this I also like the
corporate takeover uh this is the first big corporate takeover type of attempt
here whether it be on the site or the blockchain whatever way you want to
interpret it I would think I don't know if I was a big steam it fan or and held
a lot of steam I would be happy that Justin's son was taken over from an
editor who I agree with you at home one hundred percent of coins I mean it'll
bring up he's a respectable see well but he it's a more professional tape than
what was going on before that it was in the steam it never changed it always
looked the same thank you he it was forever beta it was so blind I
died the day it was born in my opinion you know the steam it was a stillborn
project everybody kept resuscitating taking turns blowing air and pumping
it's art like I felt so bad for steamed whales as as steam kept growing older
and never getting better you know yeah well hey everyone pound that like one
now okay we'll move off this will move off the steam it thing one more thing in
there you're about theorem and defy that is sort of a risk in this regard even if
the kind of damage that's happening the steam is pretty unlikely I think with
mistake on aetherium there's still the the chance of forks and there with the
power consolidation that's happening with defy something that came up in the
past couple weeks was a potential hard fork with the prague pow progressive
proof-of-work situation that was averted but if there ever is a situation where
two competing forks come up with aetherium defy has some serious problems
because you know the the projects that are supporting and I'm talking about
defy as it currently exists in a centralized fashion because the
companies that are supporting these projects would need to pick a chain and
as power gets consolidated by like maker Dow and some other projects who knows
maybe why wouldn't we maybe see a day where maker Dow wants to push its weight
around and you know that does a governance vote that supports a hard
fork to support some specific agenda that they have and then all the rest of
defy has to follow them because if they don't the cell whole system breaks
nobody can use die on the new chain because it's not being supported by
maker Dow Foundation so there's a lot of situations where hard Forks and
aetherium could really screw up defy so that's why it's gonna be really
interesting over the next couple years to see if a hard fork does come up
that's contested it'll probably be squashed like the one that just happened
you know so it's until it can't be anymore
that thank you for putting that in my mind I'm definitely gonna have to dive
down that rabbit hole sure yeah I was gonna actually ask you about that
because I I'm I'm glad you brought that up man so I I don't see how anybody in
their right mind would want a fork aetherium at this point with all that I
mean when you're defy bread and butter would be totally at risk there I mean
it's everybody's got to follow the same chain or else we're in trouble
at least all the defy protocols you know because like basically they could come
together the defy exchanges could collude and mow and pull their weight
together it's not strong enough independently and we could see the
etherium Enterprise Alliance have another Alliance to deal with that's
right all right I'm glad that was brought up by the way all these guys
Twitter's are below and from there Twitter's you can see the
they're in and all that stuff that's why I just give the Twitter but I did I did
give Chris is a special defy site down there also but chris has got good videos
Ken's got good they tweet him out all the time and everything Juan's got good
videos so yeah yeah when I get when I give her Twitter people you just you
read the whole 30 treated like a blog go down they did that great up there
alright let's I sent this article out to you guys I don't know if you guys looked
at it or not but the Brad Mills windfall gain survey did you get to look at that
Chris at all I unfortunately did not did you guys did you guys get to look at
that just to see the question he actually had a professional survey out
there finally saying to two beyond Bitcoin people just outside of our world
saying hey if you had ten years and what would you want your $10,000 in would you
want it in Bitcoin or gold or the Federal Reserve notes or a ten years US
Treasury box all that you saw that yeah it's funny I thought that the Federal
Reserve notes would have because because of who he is right because you know who
his audiences or whatever I thought they would have just a cash is king you know
I thought we would have just got one of those you know boomer answers and we did
which is pretty interesting and the first did what at first it was but then
when they got the education it wasn't that like it was they asked the question
at the beginning of the survey and then at the end of the survey and but in the
middle of the survey was all you know it was questions about how great Bitcoin
was so I think I think the point that I why I liked it so much is that when
people understand what bitcoin is they they pick it as a long-term investment
but most people don't understand what bitcoin is right now that that was I
think that that came out of the survey anyway I'd link to the survey below I
had a nine hundred and twenty votes for those wondering you know it wasn't like
we I was that Yeti this I'm talking about the end I don't know how many
people were on the survey it was 920 I don't know I think so I'm looking at the
looking at now trying to post on the information like
Ron Paul's original which it looks like that's right that's different that one
had 70,000 votes and that's why I was correlating the response though and the
other one by Brad Mills it says it has nine hundred and twenty votes and that's
though that might have changed obviously as it went this is during the time of
the screenshot it is reported 120 votes yeah
I think that was his initial question to Twitter people but the survey itself on
Twitter I'm trying to look it up now so I can get the numbers yeah anyway I
don't know why did you get just look at that more I mean please Chris yeah yeah
I think um like you said you know I'm just looking at it now and it says forty
percent of the respondents believe Bitcoin is controlled by a company you
know and it really it says 62 percent and just want to learn more about
Bitcoin because they don't know enough to be able to answer this right you know
so I'm you know this shows different results in the Twitter survey different
people it's R it's a scientific survey finally we got a real surveys well and
we're more likely to say US dollar than women interesting at first yeah at first
yeah I mean that just means like you know it's a really interesting survey
people is finally a scientific one so checked it out Bitcoin still came out
ahead in which form would you want this yeah it coin still comes out ahead
followed by US dollars and then gold it's funny gold got the bronze medal alright one did you did you have any
thoughts on that thing actually I'm looking at it right now yeah it's it's
really interesting I mean I think I think the most important takeaway here
is that Generation X Millennials and see are the ones that are most interested in
Bitcoin boomers not so much surprised surprised
you know we're this is a long multi-generational game we gotta go for
the young people they're the ones that are going to be computer literate
ones that are gonna be willing to I mean this is the reality of young people
today is that they don't have loyalty to platforms they hop around right they
move from snapchat to take talk to Santa you know before the tick-tock was
musically and then they just hop around social networks they don't they don't
care to build reputation on social networks like like we do apparently as
you know as much so I think they're gonna be the ones that are gonna be
taking a little bit and they're gonna be trying out a lot of this technology yeah
boomers are gonna are gonna outsource it to their wealth manager you know it's
like okay you know if you think it makes sense I guess go for it right because
that's that's how they just tell the world they grew up and you know and
that's I don't think that's gonna change I think I think we need to invest in the
youth right now and that'll pay off big-time in the next 10 20 years
speaking of that right there yeah I just stumbled on something really
interesting in this survey which is question 9 and question 9 is who do you
think creates new US dollars is it that the Treasury the President Congress or
Federal Reserve and half the people the number one answer was the Treasury which
is incorrect it's the Federal Reserve but then it breaks it down into age
groups and the age group that got the right answer the most out of everybody
was Millennials more Millennials than any other age group knew that the
Federal Reserve was responsible for creating new dollars and why do you
think that is I'm gonna guess right now that that's because of crypto I think
that once you get into crypto and you understand Bitcoin you start to learn
about the economy you start to learn about the nature of money you start to
learn about fiat and how dollars are created and Bitcoin is overwhelmingly
millennial so I think that that has a lot to do with the education and I think
that these are the people Millennials today and you know specifically the this
crowd that we're talking about here is going to decide the future of money yeah
and again education and once they got that education and understood they made
the rights for Mason and picked Bitcoin but interesting theory about why why
they the young that group knew about the federal
and the other ones didn't seem that as much all right yeah you guys have
comment on that survey yeah and you said education I thought that was hilarious
because I'm looking at this SES effects did you see that one yo the richest
people are the dumbest people in the room nine out of ten times sometimes but
Dave with the richest people were the ones most likely to buy Bitcoin at first
right the the wealthy were most likely to think the US dollar was backed by the
gold reserves in Fort Knox 42% and less likely to think it was backed by nothing
and controvery to the poverty poverty obviously knew that the US dollar was
backed by nothing so it's like it's funny to see that you know the the
larger pockets the smaller your mind may be sometimes because you do subcontract
out a lot of life experience or a lot of what you would normally do you know or
learn you just kind of subsidize to the servants beneath you and the service
beneath you end up learning a hell of a lot more than you know about your own
business if you're lucky if you're wealthy what's it matter where that the
money came from you got them as you good for it right yeah so that's why on the
same page of that survey it says what was the percentage by wealth level of
people who got the right answer to the question who controls Bitcoin the right
answer was nobody were the users and the top purp the top age group that got it
right was Millennials below the poverty line so it's like poor Millennials
youngin full of Bitcoin wealthy older people got it wrong but young
Millennials have that are poor that I mean they're on the internet more
probably like trying to learn trying to figure out how to get out of the
situation maybe that's not and then falling into it a lot of this you know
they're learning by just elbow room conversation you know water cooler
talking in in high school and in their groups it's the cryptocurrency is the
topic of conversation for Millennials right now so even if you're not going
out of your way to learn about it you're gonna end up hearing about it through
like Facebook or through a xbox you know live chat or something you know when
you're gaming either way I think it's coming up
more younger poor conversations than it is for the older wealthier and uh it's
and that's actually like really interesting you know think about the
educational distribution of what's happening right now is there's a very
big unbalance of understanding and an education on what this is and the
wealthy via the boomers they don't have that advantage that the Millennials have
that the you know that the people so take advantage of it guys we know more
than them all right okay let's uh let's get toward the end of we've had a long
show here today I do want to ask a wond golf real quick uh I got only question
you had ugly you had uh Glee old goat on and you were talking about Bitcoin
dominance what are you making the same about Bitcoin dominance on the show yeah
we're talking a lot about that I mean I think I think we were kind of talking
about the libertarian economic theory and some of the myths that are that are
there this is one of the ones things that I've mentioned was the theory of
private banking this there's an article called the lost art of commercial
banking which I highly recommend I putted it out and I'll tweet it again
and I think everybody should read it I'm going through right now it reads kind of
like a white papers about eight pages long and it's about private banking
during the gold standard and how that developed you know in private banking in
an environment that where there's no Federal Reserve Bank to bail them out
right and I think that's what aetherium should be looking at I think that's what
Bitcoin should be looking at I think that's what finance Intertek fine think
that people should be looking at in a world that on pegs from the dollar as as
a currency the other thing was that I think this Murray Rothbard that ugly
apparently wrote an article back in the day called calling him a robber a gold
socialist because apparently marathon wanted to like wanted to make fiat
currency legal right and at first so first sites like yeah but on second side
it's like wait a second you want to enforce a gold standard that's wrong it
needs to compete in the free market and win and and so that was really
interesting and so that that's kind of like a you know matrix cracking our idea
so anyway we talked about some of those things
and about what it what it means to have Bitcoin as the standard I think you guys
had to go check it out it's just really good good show and there's still
generally some updates about uglies newsletter and and what we're gonna be
doing good moving forward we're gonna be having a bacon standard Academy here in
Ensenada Mexico and Baja California for traders and people that are looking to
increase their their mastery of how to use Bitcoin and some of these
cryptocurrencies primarily Bitcoin really how to do you know OPSEC and
online security and how to you know mitigate some of this fake hack risks
right like SIM card tags and stuff like that so we're gonna come you're gonna
merge money management with OPSEC education and that's gonna be the big
concern at a camera with me around May 15th this I think we're aiming at it so
keep an eye out on on Uglies and in my my favorite kind of stuff all right cool
and anything else you want to add conclusionary thoughts well sure yeah I
mean I missed I missed Christmas response on on the on the proof of stake
aetherium thing I mean I'd love to I'd love to get a get get something to it I
mean I wanted to I want to thank you I wanted to engage in that a little bit
don't give me a second where I can mute you did you got that extra is that okay
yeah you took care of it yeah jitsi finally installed in my phone and that
certainly started echoing everything yeah so I mean I don't know I think it's
interesting right like the the consensus risk of exchange is holding a lot of
aetherium if it's a proof of state currency I mean that can't you can't
that can't not have an important effect on consensus right and that that the
fact that separated in Bitcoin right like the the stake in proof-of-work are
completely separated in Bitcoin that might prove to be a big big difference
in the future all right did you did you want Chris to say something about that
or yeah but if you have any thoughts of that Chris and then we can maybe talk
about a more small attempt I mean I don't want to repeat what I said before
too much but basically I said I'm it's definitely out of my scope I'm not
an etherium defender I'm a blotchy an agnostic type of guy
I also brought up that I have been following fight Alex thoughts on this
and he's made it clear over and over that that theory and proof of stake is
not going to support any code decisions any governance decisions it's
specifically for validating blocks my understanding of it which is limited
with this that's what I think of it is or my understanding is that a fork is
absolutely possible right if consolidation occurs and the biggest
risk is going to be the defy you know and I went through this before about how
defy needs to be on the same fork or else things just fall apart because
everything is connected right and so you know I think the bigger risk that we
need to be worried about as defy grows and takes market share from centralized
exchanges with with regard to etherium which I believe it will is how defy
projects are going to want to make these decisions and sort of run away with a
fork that meets their needs you know so I think that's the bigger concern for
aetherium long term then then centralization on exchange
if defy grows the way I think it's going to I suspect this is here this tema
drama depending on how it ends you know whether it ends in a steaming fork or
whether it ends on a peaceful resolution between Iran and Stephen which I think
would be positive for everybody involved I think you know despite Justin some
shrewd power games and he that is what he does I mean you gotta go listen to
that that that YouTube video where they're negotiating the resolution I
mean Jesus Christ it's guys like a politician it's like straight-up
political talk but he's you know he's he's a peacekeeper and to some degree
he's just trying to like move for very pragmatic not really interested in
principles but he can bring about a huge growth to steam it I think and but it
depending on how this plays out I think this could have some some consequences
for the development of proof of stake in aetherium right because
you know that's gonna be a contentious battle the day that it comes you know a
lot of interest there's a contingent of a theory people that don't want to move
to proof of stake as far as I understand and you know the miners are definitely
invested in proof of work in in in in aetherium so this could be this this is
good this is adding another another weapon to that that debate if that if
I'm explaining myself well yes yes I think regardless of how a theory moves
forward the risk still exists always it's existential to defy with
contentious hard Forks so in almost at a certain point doesn't matter anymore how
they happen the question is are they possible are there are their vested
interests that could bring them about and how would it affect the ecosystem
we're building which is this giant I don't want to call it a house of cards
necessarily people like to say money Legos but it is in a sense of kind of a
house of cards only when you think about the fork potential okay because if it
Forks and then they go separate ways then there's a big problem it's actually
called defy a house of cards on a house of cards once people got all just said
because I feel like it theorems already asset cards and you're gonna build it a
house of cards on that but it's III I'm excited to see where it comes from this
experiment I think a theory and we'll learn a lot from from what's happening
with steam it and steam and Justin son all right Ken since we got you here
what are your conclusion Airy thoughts any story you wanted to bring up that
got left out anything I did mention is subtly but I thought
that what's happening in India right now where the the banks are clashing with
the Supreme Court for the the ban on cryptos I I think is again it's outside
of crypto but again a presidential event in and our historical you know paradigm
shift of currency and technology and wealth distribution men like things that
banks are full-on trying their best to survive and fight back against this you
know it's a it's like if blockbuster was in the room when Netflix was asking for
a loan you know it's like of course they wouldn't have got it in
and the Supreme Court has obviously ruled in favor of cryptocurrencies but
the the Reserve Bank of India is not a is not happy they're claiming that it is
that tremendous a and there's no evidence to prove this but they're like
there Fudd is could be causing there their evidence
you know it's insane like you know a bank saying that the money isn't going
to be doing good if the government is doing this which they are doing they're
causing their own fruition you know and it's that's why they don't have the
proof of their claims today but they will because they're causing it and
they're will correlate that to the the cryptocurrency adoption but yeah I mean
India's huge and I want to see what happens there and I'm looking at it
through rose-tinted glasses at the moment you know because the skeptical me
with my tinfoil hat on so tight my you know it's it's the China ban all over
again you know we've been dealing with India for a while now with this and I'm
just curious to see when we're gonna see you know the bank lobby their way into
the Supreme Court's pocket and get this reversed and then whatever six months
later they decide to do it again so they can get paid again and it just keeps
becoming this laundering extorting you know lobbying circle that never ends in
India financial Game of Thrones yeah and when in China forever man it was just a
way for the politicians to get a bunch of money in their pocket from the crypto
Pro lobbyists right so it's like we ban it then they get paid okay it's unbanned
the money runs out we banded again we get paid we unbanned it India this could
be a very similar event but hopefully I'm not I'll say this I was initially
happy when they it was two days here and all that they said Bitcoin or
cryptocurrency was legal but I said on the show India is notorious for his
bureaucracy and holding everything up and and look look they're trying to hold
it up create bureaucracy there correct a incredibly corrupt a bureaucracy too so
I wouldn't be surprised if your scenario comes true like the correctly it's
leading then it's illegal then we bribe and it's legal then we bribe
I have an interesting little insight into this I'm friends with Sonny Ray who
ran founded and ran one of the biggest Indian exchanges and the moment that
this happened he sent me a message he's like we beat him you know and and I
think he sent me a link to an article and such so I think I'm a little more
optimistic you know like there's a difference between an administrative
ruling to ban I think that as a Communist Party of China would do in a
Supreme Court decision and what appears to be a country with a Supreme Court I
guess I guess they have some common law instead of European influence there and
so that should be like those Supreme Court decisions tend to take a long time
and that ban lasted like three years it was really brutal but now you know this
that ruling that's a very deep change so if there's any other attacks on crypto
they're probably gonna be administrative and and they're not gonna be at a
constitutional sort of like you know level so to speak so I think this is
very good for India for crypto so it's a good sign in India I mean there's a lot
of money there you know so if that's maybe that's the beginning of the next
bull market you know I agree it could be the South Korea South Korea went wild in
late 2017 buying up a bunch of crypto hopefully one day it'll be India because
India has got a lot more people and you know all those most of them don't have
access to the internet or whatever but everyone understands the potential
second most populated country on earth etc all right
let's Kris you got the final word final words so I would encourage everybody
listening to this to pay attention to even if you never plan to use dphi on
aetherium pay attention to the Bitcoin projects that are occurring that are
going to be building these trustless bridges that we talked about before and
I'll tell you a couple to look at I'm not involved with any of them but I'm
observing them closely TBT TBT sees one trusted Bitcoin from
keep project there's ren project and then one was
announced yesterday called p tokens which is a centralized pretty
centralized version but the other two are more trustless still at levels of
centralization just pay attention because what's going to start happening
is more and more bitcoins to be traded on etherium and even today
as of today there's a centralized solution for tokenizing bitcoin called
rats bitcoin mm-hmm that you can use on etherium there is just as much if not
more Bitcoin trading on aetherium right now than lightning Network okay they're
pretty much headin head neck and neck okay so it's an 8 million I'm lightning
around 8 million trading on aetherium once these new bridges open up that's
gonna double triple quadruple so you know we've got the Bitcoin crowd that we
know are like you know the hardcore never use a theory on people think about
all the people who are just holding Bitcoin have been sitting on it since
2017 and just maybe want to earn some interest without having to go into a
centralized exchange in UK YC those are people who might take advantage of this
to just shift it over leave it in compound or one of these protocols and
just wait and see what happens pay attention to it if nothing else it's
gonna be important story I just want to say that you know as somebody that wants
bacon to be currency and believes that bitcoin is the best currency that we can
probably play with right now especially in the age in the digital age this to me
is a good sign you know if a theory mr.

Unistart denominating their contracts in
bitcoin and taking the systemic risk go for it right let users sort of play with
that and hopefully the ledger care users properly on that but yeah if the
denomination asks you know and I think there's been a lot of debate about sort
of maxi bears maximalist versus shit coins and stuff I think that critical
critique that that big winners have against all coins is the fact that
they're trying to create a new unit of account and they're trying to create
with a worse fundamentals or worse distribution right just build on Bitcoin
in it and this is a kind of you know building with Bitcoin so I think that's
great that's really great news yeah I mean eath has to remain the base
layer obviously and it has to be the securing asset which is what makes this
whole thing very interesting you know where you have eath securing the
etherium network and then this growing amount of Bitcoin it's being traded on
top of that so that's where it gets kind of is it polarized like it's fully
collateralized Bitcoin with the versions floating BTC
BTC PBT see these new versions of BT and even wrapped bitcoin is fully
collateralized right but it's custodial with bit go right these new versions are
aiming towards trust lessness so you can still find centralized aspects if you
dig deep enough but they're closer okay and eventually we're gonna get
completely trust list and then we're gonna have this fluid sort of back and
forth and it's gonna be programmatic and you won't even know it's happening
and ten years from now we're gonna start laughing that we went through so much
trouble trying to get across chain because it's gonna be so fluid that it
won't even matter the big question is that eath right and a lot of people
think okay if just needs to it will organically rise in value to secure the
level of bitcoin that is brought over so there's a it's a big question because if
the amount of Bitcoin exceeds what it's got underlying it then you got problems
right especially if you can programmatically redeem your token back
for a Bitcoin a lot of questions but that's why I'm saying keep an eye on
it's gonna be a big story this year all right man all right Golden Age man at so
many cool things going on in this space yeah ten years is gonna be a lot
different but this this this 10 this decade is gonna be the Golden Age it's
gonna be great compete don't complain keep on being creative people all right
that is the end of the show it was a very good show today guys well i'm adam
meister thank you guest the bitcoinmeister the disrupt meister
remember to subscribe this channel like this video shows you check out the links
below also remember yeah at the end of the month bitcoin 2020 in san francisco
if you're going to be in san francisco contact me dude this bet this event
better keep on it's gonna happen i'm not afraid to meet people in person
in san francisco to talk they went big 120 and they I sort of mentioned that at
the beginning the show and people were asking are you gonna travel soon still
yeah of course I'm traveling for Bitcoin San Francisco but who knows who knows
guys made this sickness go away soon and everybody get back to normal but shabbat
shalom everybody have a great time today and pound the like button and we do this
show every Friday be back now week I do a new show here every day so
it's tomorrow's do beyond Bitcoin show again this was it this was a great show
really really good combo of people you don't hear this stuff best guest in the
space guys we will see you soon thank you bye bye good night awesome other day
yeah

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