INVESTIR en 1er sur BITCOIN pour finalement adopter BCH et mener -interview de Roger Ver

Hi roger i'm pretty happy to have you for uh 
this podcast on john aldecoin's channel um we'll   go straight to the point you are a successful uh 
entrepreneur you're known as bitcoin jesus you're   one of the earliest investor in bitcoin and you 
founded a few successful companies and much more   your journey is let's say definitely inspiring 
and the thing is that you're oftenly described   by your competitors or people who have something 
against you to the people who don't know you could   you tell us who you are who you started as an 
entrepreneur how you discovered bitcoin all these   questions yeah um i guess i've been a lifelong 
entrepreneur but as an adult it got started in   silicon valley uh selling computer components i 
was born and raised in silicon valley and started   a couple of different successful companies there 
uh the most well-known one to maybe early early   bitcoin people would be which 
was the first uh established business uh with   annual sales in the multi-millions of dollars uh 
to start accepting bitcoin uh in the entire world   up to that point maybe the biggest business was 
just a homemade guy that was selling uh socks made   from alpaca wall that he was making himself and 
i'm super you know grateful to the alpaca guy for   selling his socks for bitcoin early on but uh that 
wasn't uh you know much of a mainstream business   at that point whereas with my business uh we put 
a billboard up on the you know side of the busiest   expressway in silicon valley and i started 
paying for radio ads on more than 100 radio   stations across the us and uh it got worldwide 
media attention to that because it was the first   time an actual you know established business 
started accepting bitcoin for payments i was   the first one in the world to do that for abort 
aboveboard products that you know weren't you know   illegal drugs on the dark net so so i remember 
that the first time we had a chat uh we we've   explored a lot of topics including libertarianism 
and volunteerism this interview is also available   like on the top corner of this video for the 
people watching us uh i would like you to   tell us about the relationship between your 
belief as a volunteerist and cryptocurrencies   yeah i i think those were two things that 
were you know joined at the hip there   um it was because i was already a libertarian and 
a free market advocate that i became interested   in bitcoin and cryptocurrencies because i 
viewed them as a way to empower the individual   to have more control over their lives and to 
disempower the state from being able to control   peaceful people and uh in fact just yesterday 
i was uh with some french canadians that spoke   french as their first language and we were talking 
about frederick bastia who wrote the law and uh   economic uh harmonies and economic socialism and 
like just an amazing amazing guy and i only got to   read his works after they had been translated from 
french into english but i was recommending it to   these uh native french speakers i bet if you read 
frederick bastiat in his native language it's even   better than it is after having been translated 
into english so uh for any french viewers you   know please pick up frederick bastian's the law 
and uh i imagine it'll really change the the way   you view the world he was such an amazing thinker 
ahead of his time and uh i'm definitely a big fan   of his and he's one of the people that made me 
so excited about bitcoin because suddenly now   there's this tool that enables any individual 
anywhere on the planet to be able to send and   receive money with anyone else anywhere on the 
planet there's nothing that governments can do   to stop it that's a wonderful wonderful thing for 
every single human being on the planet because   uh you know it's not from the benevolence of the 
butcher or breaker we expect our daily bread from   his regard for his own self-interest and that's 
the quote from frederick bastiat and bitcoin or   cryptocurrencies enable people to interact with 
people all over the world so that out of people's   own self-interest they can help every other 
person all over the world and uh this is you know   frederick basket was writing about this hundreds 
of years ago but now it's enabled on a wide wide   scale across the world thanks to the invention of 
cryptocurrencies and it's just uh such an exciting   time to be alive because now this is possible and 
before the internet and before cryptocurrencies   it wasn't possible all right well thank you for 
this answer now let's go straight to the hot topic   which is um you're know for your involvement 
with bitcoin cash and my question in 2020 is   that i would like you to explain to the french 
audience and to me actually how this bitcoin   cash stands out as a peer-to-peer electronic 
cash solution and i mean like nowadays you know   there are plenty of trustless solutions that are 
scalable cheap and sometimes ensuring privacy   that exists how does bch achieve this better than 
the others or stands out in your opinion please   yeah bitcoin cash is is stand out and it doesn't 
mean i don't like the other ones i'm you know huge   fans of you know monero and z cash and z coin 
and and i'm a fan of absolutely anything that   works but the thing that has me so excited about 
bitcoin cash specifically is it's accepted at more   than a hundred thousand websites around the world 
it's accepted at more physical locations than any   other cryptocurrency anywhere in the world uh and 
it has fast cheap reliable payments for the world   and it works right now today it's not dependent 
on some future technology that doesn't exist yet   and i think that's a really really big deal 
and you know maybe bitcoin will solve its   high fee problems and slow transaction problems 
but maybe it won't or maybe monero will get   you know a whole bunch more traction and a lot 
more you know usage around the world and we'll   be able to overcome the regulatory hurdles 
that a cryptocurrency that's so private has   but maybe it won't right and bitcoin cash has all 
these things net right now people don't realize   uh bitcoin cash has another thing called cash 
fusion built on top of it which gives bitcoin   cash privacy in the same ballpark as a monero uh 
if you use it properly there too and then bitcoin   cash has amazing tokens you can make your own 
token in like 20 seconds over at   and then and then tether is already on top of uh 
of bitcoin cash as well if you're sitting around   tether on ethereum you're paying you know five 
maybe ten bucks per transaction if you do it on   bitcoin cash you're paying about a twentieth of 
a penny per transaction so the transactions that   bitcoin cash are basically free and they're super 
fast super cheap and super reliable and i see lots   of people on the internet doing name calling 
against bitcoin cash but calling it be cash   isn't an argument against its you know fast cheap 
reliable payments for the world and what i see   mostly is it's a bunch of people that have already 
bought bitcoin and they see bitcoin cash is a   threat to bitcoin's market share dominance and 
they think oh if bitcoin cash gets more traction   i'm not going to i'm not going to become a 
millionaire because of my bitcoin holdings well   if you're if your only goal increa your 
involvement in cryptocurrency is just to get   rich and become a millionaire in terms of dollars 
you've missed the entire point of cryptocurrency   the entire point is to enable people to engage 
and trade with other people all over the world   without needing permission from others and bitcoin 
used to be you know the front runner being able to   enable that for the world as someone who is using 
it to send and receive payments with people over   the world it stopped working for that in 2017. 
a lot of people don't realize it today but the   average transaction fee in 2017 got to be 50 
per transaction and the average confirmation   time got to be two weeks and during that two-week 
period your transaction could be reversed as well   and then lots of people you'll hear argue today 
say oh well now the bitcoin transaction fees   aren't so high they're cheap now well if that is 
that's fine and dandy but the software engineers   that manage to get a hold of the bitcoin protocol 
development openly say that they don't want the   fees to be cheap they openly say they want the 
blocks to be full which lead to slow expense of   unreliable transactions so if you're arguing that 
bitcoin transactions they aren't slow expensive   and unreliable you're arguing that the you know 
the bitcoin core developers have failed in their   goal to make the vision of bitcoin that they want 
so uh and i'm not here to bash on bitcoin i'm just   stating the truth about bitcoin if you want a 
payment network that's fast cheap and reliable   and enables people to deal with each other 
peer-to-peer all over the world it's not bitcoin   uh there's lots of other cryptocurrencies to 
do it but it's not bitcoin today and that's why   as i think about how bad things must have gotten 
for the owner of and the first person   the entire world is basically build up the 
entire ecosystem to have to stop promoting   it and that's how horrible the user experience 
became with bitcoin uh to where more times than   i can count i had to pay more than a thousand 
dollars for a single transaction on the bitcoin   network uh and then the other people who obviously 
aren't using bitcoin uh or they'd know about it   then start calling me a liar or claiming i did 
something wrong but the math is very very clear   uh the average transaction fee uh was fifty 
dollars but anybody that's running in sort of a   business accepting multiple payments you're paying 
thousands of dollars in transactions more times   than they can count and uh that's why bitcoin uh 
it used to just be you know bitcoin businesses   now there's thousands of cryptocurrencies and uh 
i wish them all luck i'm excited there's so many   exciting ones out there uh it's just a question 
which one is going to bring the most economic   freedom to the most people around the world in 
the shortest amount of time that's the one that   i'm going to support and i don't care if it's 
bitcoin cash or you know avalob's new uh one   or whatever it is like there's there's a million 
exciting things happening out there and it's it's   a it's a good thing and just like i hope something 
better than my current iphone comes out uh so we   all get to use that i hope something current uh 
better than bitcoin cash or better than any other   cryptocurrency out there comes out because then 
the whole world gets to benefit from that as well   so yeah um quite a few questions out of your 
answer that's popped up in my mind last time we   spoke in tokyo i think um you know i was talking 
about lightning network and you challenged me on   the spot to actually show you a mobile wallet or 
something that is decently like that's easy to use   to make a transaction in the lightning network 
like something that's that has a good ui and ux i   mean and you know like two years after i think the 
situation has evolved a little bit you know with   blue wallet deploying some let's say accessible 
solutions to transact on the lightning network uh   has your take on lightning network change because 
i remember that two years ago you wouldn't believe   in it um what's your what's your vision regarding 
this solution which like yeah would eventually   make bitcoin scale scalable let's say yeah if if 
it does fantastic but uh clearly they crippled   these the adoption of bitcoin worldwide uh in 
the hopes that a technology that at that time   certainly didn't exist yet and even today the user 
experience with lightning is absolutely horrible   i go around getting physical bitcoin non-custodial 
tips i'm giving private keys to people in bitcoin   cash all over the world and you can do it through 
youtube videos i give it to servers at restaurants   i give it to people all over the place you can't 
do that with lightning it's it's impossible to do   that with lightning in a non-custodial uh manner 
there and if you're using a custodial service you   might as well just go back to using paypal or 
bank of america or you know whatever custodial   service that you're using before cryptocurrency 
and most of the lightning wants without taking uh   you know a bunch of extra work and doing a 
bunch of extra steps um are basically just fancy   custodial services not any different than paypal 
and if you're using a custodial lightning service   well why not just use paypal and so i think uh 
clearly lightning so far to this date has been a   massive failure the fact that there's somewhere in 
the ballpark of uh i think it's almost a thousand   times more ethereum wrapped uh i'm sorry more 
bitcoin wrapped in the ethereum network than there   is in the lightning network also shows that the 
ethereum has been a far far far more successful   layer two scaling solution for bitcoin than the 
lightning network has whereas at the time when the   argument was being made to limit the block size on 
bitcoin the arguments were like oh everybody can   just use lightning well that sure turned out to 
be wrong uh way more people started using ethereum   uh wrapped bitcoin or just plain using ethereum 
itself and forgetting about bitcoin altogether   if you go to any of the ethereum devcon 
conferences wow an amazing amount of brain power   and developer power there uh far more than any uh 
recent bitcoin conference that i've been aware of   all right despite your um your vision of the 
current bitcoin do you still see like bitcoin   as a store of value despite the fact that on 
the functional end it's not like there yet   no i i don't uh at this point so if you study 
the economics nothing can be a store of value   without having a second additional use case and i 
think the second additional use case in the forms   of cryptocurrencies is being usable for payments 
and that usefulness for payments has been severely   damaged on bitcoin and at this point i think 
it's just this big advertising campaign like hey   if you buy a bunch of bitcoin with your dollars 
today and then we get a bunch more people to   buy bitcoin with their dollars tomorrow you can 
sell the bitcoins that you bought today for more   dollars tomorrow and like if you want to do that 
go ahead but you've missed the entire point of how   cryptocurrencies can benefit all of humankind and 
it's by having censorship resistant peer-to-peer   payments for the world that work in any country 
for anybody black or white young or old rich or   poor uh you have to be rich to use bitcoin at this 
point with five dollar transaction fees no poor   person is ever going to consider using that uh 
uh bitcoin cash works for everybody all over the   world and so do a thousand other cryptocurrencies 
out there uh i think bitcoin has just become   this big speculative vehicle for rich people to 
speculate on on other people uh speculating on   the future that's not something that's exciting or 
interesting or or philosophically fulfilling to me   one bit uh i want to empower individuals to have 
control over their own money not to use custodial   services run by the rich people that are gonna 
you know just make themselves even richer by by   tricking other people into buying an asset that 
that doesn't actually do anything for them in   their lives and uh they'd never dream of buying 
a hamburger or a coffee with it you know i paid   i paid for my dinner last night at a restaurant 
here in bitcoin cash and i took more away to go   and i ate it for breakfast this morning like 
i'm using bitcoin cash for every transaction   the shirt i'm wearing the shorts i'm wearing and 
everything in my life is revolving around bitcoin   cash payments now just like i did for bitcoin uh 
early on but bitcoin doesn't work for that anymore   now but bitcoin cash does all right so for you 
um an instrument can it be a store of value if   it doesn't have another like um if it does i mean 
like if it doesn't have another function adding to   that store value like yeah um function like i get 
it but you you you say that pc bch like you you   do foresee bch as something beyond the payment 
solution and you know when you look at bch it   doesn't support like all sorts of smart contracts 
i mean i've been checking that like you've been   deploying simple ledger protocol but isn't doesn't 
that put like bch in a position which makes it   less in um it is like less competitive compared 
to what's out there smart contract wise maybe but   the network effect is incredibly important too 
i think the only reason bitcoin is still number   one is it has this huge network effect combined 
with its horrible user experience bitcoin cash   has a smaller network effect but with a great user 
experience and then there's these other coins out   there that could have arguably an even better user 
experience with all the smart contracts and super   fast cheap uh transactions but they have a much 
much smaller network effect than even bitcoin cash   and so which one of those things are going to 
wind up in the end i don't know that's why i   own a bid of all of these things i have a diverse 
portfolio of all of them and i think that's what   this the smart thing for anybody to do right all 
right um how about ethereum you know like lately   there's been like this frenzy there's been this 
trend with decentralized finance uh taking off   during the summer have you been like have you been 
trying these new financial products that have been   deployed on ethereum have you been providing 
liquidity whatsoever what's your what's your   vision regarding that yeah there's there's so much 
happening that there's i'm there it's more than   any one human being could keep up with with all 
the urine and the sushi and you know all the just   amazing stuff that's going on there so have i been 
participating a little bit mainly by doing lending   of ethereum to different uh linden desks and that 
sort of thing um but there's you know a whole new   and we're building an entire new monetary system 
for the world and that new monetary system for the   world it isn't just bitcoin it isn't just ethereum 
it isn't just bitcoin cash it's all of these   things all interacting together uh just like the 
current economy isn't only microsoft or only apple   or only ford or only tesla it's all these you know 
billions of different things all working together   in uh you know cooperation with everything else 
that's the world's economy and and the same is   true with these cryptocurrencies it's not just one 
it's not just uh the other it's all these things   working together so people can use you know you 
know swap for some stuff you can use bitcoin for   another you can use bitcoin cash for something 
else like the more options people have out there   in their lives uh the better and that's why it's 
great that we can choose between ford and tesla   and it's great that we can choose between you know 
bitcoin ethereum bitcoin cash and you know take   your pick from a thousand other ones out there 
this is good for everybody and it leads to you   know competition leads to a better quality product 
for more people at a lower price and we're seeing   that happen in the cryptocurrency space as well 
all right now let's talk a little bit more about   yourself um i remember your decision if i'm right 
to divorce with your motherland by rejecting your   let's say citizenship you're 
american citizenship i'm right yeah   yeah i i kind of feel like they rejected me 
or the politicians that rejected me first   so the feeling i i suppose was mutual so 
now you're you're a saint kitts citizen um   i mean like you you you're um you're saying kids 
citizen right yeah i'm a citizen of saint kitts so   the proper term is a condition uh and i actually 
have several other citizenships as well so i guess   they're kind of like like cryptocurrencies you 
should collect all the good ones and avoid the   the bad ones there so all right why do you 
run business in japan actually why this choice   um i haven't been to japan at all like hardly at 
all this year the coronavirus lockdown kind of   changed that and uh i'd only been staying in 
japan less than half of each year anyhow but   japan is a wonderful place as well um but my main 
business stuff uh at this point have been uh in   the caribbean mr riemann all right for a while 
now so that's like we could call it your favorite   country to live i mean like uh as a cryptocurrency 
guy uh there's lots of great stuff about japan   there's lots of great stuff about antigua there's 
lots of great stuff about saint kitts and there's   lots of great stuff about lots of places in the 
world and uh i guess shout out to another youtube   channel i i really i'm a fan of it's called the 
nomad capitalist and the slogan over there is go   where you're treated best and i think that's great 
advice for for anybody's you know it's a big big   world out there go wherever you're treated the 
best and i think that's good advice for everybody   all right now let's switch topic it's no secret 
that you have important cryptocurrency holdings   how do you handle security uh online and also in 
the street life like it must be very stressful   i mean like have you been dealing with issues or 
people like trying to to mess up with you how do   how do you live with that yes i don't want to say 
too much to give away too many you know security   secrets there but uh one change that's kind of 
happened in my my thinking and view over this   and i think my original thinking is still 
right for for most people most of the time   i wanted everybody to hold their 
own cryptocurrency themselves   and that way it couldn't be seized or controlled 
or you know have governments come in and   the us government literally came in and 
stole the gold from every single american uh   last century if everybody's using a custodial 
account where you know coinbase or finance or   somebody's holding everybody's cryptocurrency 
for them the government could very easily go   into that company and say give us everybody's you 
know bitcoin and so that's why i thought it was   so important for everybody to hold it themselves 
because if everybody's holding their private keys   themselves there's no place the government 
can go to to take everybody's cryptocurrency   um for big holders that have a lot that are maybe 
worried about you know robberies or kidnappings or   ransom or that sort of thing uh maybe it's a very 
good idea to have a custodian hold a lot of your   cryptocurrency so that way if you or somebody 
new or you know ever kidnapped or extorted or   something like that you can honestly say hey i 
don't have any cryptocurrency to give you or i   have very little cryptocurrency to give you it's 
all with a custodian that's not going to give it   to you anyhow um and so maybe that's something 
for you know high net worth individuals to   think about is using a custodian simply for 
a safety measure there because that way if   you're ever kidnapped you say hey i honestly 
don't have any cryptocurrency to give you so   so i think you know depending on how much crypto 
you have you can balance it between holding it   yourself and using a custodian of some sort fair 
enough um do you still hold bitcoin yeah of course   i still hold bitcoin yeah so in fact uh i've been 
i've been holding you know bitcoin for a long time   i'm sure i have more bitcoin than just about 
every bitcoin maximalist out there uh but i've   been selling bitcoin call options recently and 
then i've been using it to buy more uh previously   i was using to buy more bitcoin cash all the time 
more recently i've been using the the money earned   from that to buy more ethereum and that's been 
working out very well as well uh mainly because   there's been some drama within the bitcoin cash 
ecosystem with one of the developers trying to   significantly alter the the stability and the 
and the roadmap for the bitcoin cash protocol so   guess what investors like stability uh when you 
don't have stability in bitcoin cash they switch   to buying other things like ethereum which is 
what i've been doing recently and the ethereum   ecosystem is just amazing with all the stuff 
that's happening there so i assume that you   have still a big proportion of your wallets uh 
in of your folio in bitcoin cash how do you hedge   yourself against market corrections do you have 
any strategies any tip any method i want to be   exposed to as much the volatility as i possibly 
can because i think the long run the long-term   trend is that the price is going to go up and so 
if the price goes up a lot i want to make sure i   was exposed to that volatility whereas if i had 
hedged at all the price went up oh but i missed   out on all of it because i had hedged hedged 
all the volatility risk away uh so i want to   be exposed to as much of that volatility over as 
long a period of time as i possibly can which was   my exact same strategy with bitcoin and ethereum 
and all the other cryptocurrencies i've been   involved in all right and do you do you recognize 
yourself as a trader do you have a trading desk um   yeah are you trying i've been doing some lending 
the few the very very very few times i tried to   trade anything myself and saw oh this news came 
out and you know of course the price is going to   go up or the price is going to go down and i tried 
to trade on it uh it got wrecked right the market   always goes the the opposite way of what i was 
expecting so i i forget what was some big exchange   got hacked or something and uh i thought oh this 
has to be bad news so like i'll sell some now and   i'll buy it back in a week when the price is lower 
so i sold some and of course the price went up so   but so i learned my lessons i i only did that i 
think maybe once maybe twice so now i just hold it   or or lend for interest all right and regarding 
like investment out of the crypto space do you   do you do like ventures into like i don't know 
biotechs or anything do you have some fields   that you really believe in do you diversify here 
to give us some more details about that yeah   so i'm actually recording this from a country 
called the antigua uh here in the caribbean and   i invested a huge amount of money in a stem cell 
treatment facility here that's due to open uh and   the coronavirus it would have been open a long 
time ago not for the the world being so crazy   with the coronavirus stuff but uh we can treat all 
sorts of different things here what factor a stem   cell facility oh yeah yes uh so what they do and 
the medical scientists are more qualified to talk   about it than i am but uh basically they're taking 
stem cells out of the umbilical cord between a   mother and her child and those are special cells 
that basically get a free pass you can inject them   into anybody and they won't reject them because 
those cells don't belong to the mother they don't   belong to the baby you can inject them in just 
about anybody and uh you know there's something   special about them where the bodies don't reject 
them as being foreign cells and they're uh   you know i'm really excited about the advances 
that are going to be able to be made there   and uh i'm looking to invest in more companies 
working on extreme life extension because uh   there's nothing more boring than being dead right 
or if all your friends and family are dead that's   pretty boring too so i want everybody to have 
the option to live as long as they want to be   able to live in you know long healthy uh you 
know happy lifetimes and uh including myself   and my own friends and family so i want to take 
more and more of the funds that i've earned in my   involvement in cryptocurrency and start investing 
it in uh extreme life extension technologies so   yeah interesting so yeah i mean 
like health is one of the most   like it's the most important capital let's 
say i mean pointless to be rich and be in a   miserable state of course and one question that 
has been like that i've been receiving a lot   would you care sharing with us your 
crypto 88 or at least in bitcoin uh uh well i think the highest uh bitcoin hit 
was around twenty thousand dollars in 2017   so uh your your stack basically in 
bitcoin the amount uh oh the number   of bitcoins that i ever held at one point 
so that's the question i received a lot   there's there's lots of rumors floating around on 
the internet with all sorts of different numbers   uh anywhere from broke to i think the highest 
i've seen floating around like half a million   bitcoins or something like that and uh i won't 
confirm or deny any of those uh those rumors i respect that no that's that's that's 
perfectly all right um okay okay okay um   one other question i had like basically like 
newswire newswise what's your take on what's going   on like the the libra project for instance what 
do you think about it yeah yeah i i haven't heard   much news about it uh recently but i was watching 
the interview that um oh his name's escaping   me right now but the the guy that's basically 
the ceo or chairman of libra former paypal of   david marcus that's the one he did 
an amazing amazing fantastic job   dealing with the us congress um i would not have 
been able to to be as civil with those people as   he was he did such a fantastic job and there 
was only base like you know one or maybe two   of the the actual politicians in there that had 
any understanding of what was going on and one   of the guys asked david marcus clearlike so if 
a user has their own private keys for libra do   they own their crypto full stop yes or no 
and finally i think david marcus had to say   yes they they own their own their own crypto 
and to me i think that was all i need to know   like if you own your own private keys you own 
your libra that's a fantastic thing and this   can be an on-boarding mechanism for the entire 
world uh and facebook has a huge network effect   but if they don't design the cryptocurrency in a 
way in which it's super useful maybe people will   jump ship into you know monero or ethereum or or 
bitcoin cash or take your pick and so all these   cryptocurrencies are all competing against each 
other and so if facebook comes out with their   own cryptocurrency great if the federal reserve 
bank comes out with their own cryptocurrency and   if it's one where if you have the private keys 
you own the cryptocurrency full stop fantastic   as well like the more the more options people 
have in the world for this sort of thing uh   the better and the more on-ramps and off-ramps 
people have the better and if imagine a facebook   provided that on and off ramp for everybody all 
over the world that would be fantastic uh if so   yeah i'm a fan of anything that gives people 
more options in their lives around the world   and libra seems to be one of those things 
but uh but will it be the best one out there   time will tell but i'm not very optimistic on that 
i i think there's other cryptocurrencies that uh   probably do a better job at uh at being money 
yeah we've seen like coercion and you know like   authorities like the sec or the cftc cracking down 
on exchanges and which would eventually crack down   on even more platforms and even more users of 
cryptocurrencies do you foresee a world where   uh things are going to remain like that 
don't you don't you expect that there is a   real risk coming from governmental institutions 
to bottleneck or destroy what has been achieved   uh with cryptocurrency adoption what's your take 
on that you know we've seen bitmaps being shut   down a few days ago why yeah yeah i was just going 
to mention that with bitmex it's so crazy like if   you don't like bitmex don't use it and then what 
happens is they indict you know one of the biggest   crypto platforms in the entire world that's 
competing with the established legacy players   right you have the the cme and uh i guess 
backed or whatever in the us which are these   big traditional finance you know institutions 
whereas the new up and comer bit max uh you know   run by people that were in crypto early on they're 
the ones that get indicted so it just looks like   more you know crony capitalism to me where the 
the existing legacy players are using the legacy   system to just squash out their their competition 
and i've never made a single trade on bitmex   um but other people uh you know obviously liked it 
it was a huge platform and i was talking with one   you know all he does he trades all day every day 
he's a professional trader for for years and years   and years now uh and he was pretty annoyed because 
he said that bit max was way better than the other   options now they took away uh one of his best 
options now he either has to go to use a chinese   exchange like okay you know exchange ok x or some 
of these other ones that i don't trust as far as   i can throw them uh with okay exchange the other 
ones maybe are better but uh or you can use cme   uh or or backed and like he said their products 
suck compared to bit mac so like they basically   took out the the most trustworthy best platform 
that was out there uh and i guess it's just   really frustrating i think the market is the 
best production for consumers now we're seeing   the same thing with uh they're going after 
john mcafee right like we the government can   print as much money as they want at any time 
for any reason yet they want to throw like   a 70-something-year-old man in prison until he 
dies because he didn't give him some of his money   and then they're also complaining that he was 
promoting different you know icos or whatnot   and they're mad about that look 
at social security in the u.s   every single american is forced to participate 
in that fractional reserve ponzi scheme   yet none of the government agencies complain one 
a bit about it and if you try to opt out of it   they'll send you to jail like what an incredible 
double standard what a bunch of lying hypocritical   you know tyrants to do that they want to throw 
john mcafee in jail for voluntarily promoting   hey you could buy this ico if you want to with 
your own money that belongs to you whereas in   the u.s every single person has to donate to 
the ponzi scheme social security that's not you   know it's totally fractional reserve the entire 
time and if you don't you get sent to jail like   it's just stunning to me that people think that 
like it's okay to go after john mcafee uh rather   than you know the people that running the social 
security ponzi scheme uh but that's the crazy   wild world we live in and uh i guess the only 
option you have is to start using cryptocurrency   and opt out of it and for people that want to opt 
out of the us system i'll promote uh you can go   to uh antigua and you can pay in bitcoin 
cash for your entire citizenship here in antigua   you can set up an antigua corporation you can do 
all kinds of things there that's antigua help calm   you can pay for everything in bitcoin cash and 
it's run by the uh the formula the former attorney   general of the entire country is now accepting 
bitcoin cash for all of his services here and uh   if you if you want to reach out to him through the 
website you can tell me roger veer sent you uh uh   i'm you know helping him with all sorts of stuff 
there so uh really really uh nice to see that sort   of thing happening here uh and uh you know the us 
better watch out there's a there's now competition   in in uh government systems around the world and 
all these different governments around the world   have to compete so that people will wind up going 
where they're treated best and uh so anyhow check   out the antigua help calm for more information 
on that right well um just one last thing about   i wanted to know your feeling regarding the 
next american elections and also how the given   what you've been saying like earlier previously i 
assume that you believe that kobe 19 is also like   a setup to to to let's say yeah um reduce i don't 
know a setup might be a little bit stronger but   it's absolutely it's absolutely the excuse or the 
justification justification that every government   around the world is using to control every aspect 
of everybody's lives uh but you know that's part   of life if there wasn't death it wouldn't call it 
wouldn't be called life it would just be existence   and uh you know people die we want to prevent 
people from dying but uh think about how many   millions of lives can be saved saved every single 
year if you ban people from driving more than   five miles an hour right but no like there's a 
trade-off to be had there it's nice to be able   to drive 65 miles an hour and even though more 
people will die the amount of you know additional   economic activity and time saving and things 
that people are able to do by being able to drive   65 miles an hour or 100 kilometers an hour in 
europe or wherever is a lot better than only   being able to drive you know five miles an hour or 
ten kilometers an hour and the trade-off is worth   and so there's it's worth it and there's a lot 
more to life than just avoiding death right you   want to be able to spend time with your friends 
and family and not you know self-isolating and   hiding at home and fear of everything so people 
need to be able to get on with their lives and   enjoy their lives and for those that are truly 
afraid of the coroner virus i respect that you   can stay home and self-isolate but don't force the 
rest of us to basically give up our lives and give   up their ability to see our friends and family and 
enjoy life because you're afraid if you're afraid   you can stay home and self-isolate don't force the 
rest of us uh to do the same thing all right thank   you i think we've covered like everything that we 
could in that time frame do you have anything that   you'd like to share with the french community 
like any message yeah don't don't be uh don't   be a closed-minded fool right go out there and 
experiment with these different cryptocurrencies   uh don't believe everything you see on social 
media too and it's just stunning how much   manipulation goes on uh in social media or the 
or even just the regular media uh it's just   stunning so i really uh implore everybody to think 
for themselves and uh because i think in large   part this will be going out to a french audience 
i wish i could read it in french myself but go out   and pick up anything by frederic bastiat that was 
written in french originally and you'll see the   world more clearly and you'll be a better person 
for having read anything by frederic bastiata and   uh you know reach out to me send me an email roger 
at and let me know what you thought of   the book uh reading it in its native language of 
french i'd be really curious to hear because it   was fantastic in english it must be even more 
amazing in in the native language yeah so fish   economic for instance is one one i mean like yeah 
yeah it's one like key key element of bastia well   definitely well thank you very much roger via for 
your time it's been a pleasure having you on this   show and i hope that we would eventually have a 
follow-up to this interview in maybe a few years   or a few months if something like interesting 
happens in bitcoin cash or another currency and i   would love to have your comment on that yeah thank 
you very much have a wonderful day and subscribe   to this channel share it with a friend as well see 
everybody next time cheers thank you very much you

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